Labor, Childbirth, and Delivery: A Mother Daughter Conversation
In this episode, Alyssa and Nadia discuss childbirth and share Alyssa shares her personal experiences. Nadia has limited knowledge about childbirth and relies on assumptions and what she has seen in TV shows. Alyssa explains the basics of childbirth and the individuality of this incredible life experience. They also discuss pain management options such as epidurals and natural births. Alyssa shares her personal story of going into labor and the challenges she faced. They touch on the importance of prenatal care and postpartum care for both the mother and the baby. In this conversation, Alyssa and Nadia discuss Alyssa's experiences with pregnancy and childbirth. They cover topics such as labor pains, epidurals, complications, breastfeeding, and cravings. Alyssa shares her personal experiences and offers advice on advocating for oneself and seeking support from lactation consultants. They also touch on the challenges of balancing medical school and motherhood in the future.
childbirth, labor, delivery, pain management, epidural, natural birth, prenatal care, postpartum care, pregnancy, childbirth, labor pains, epidural, complications, breastfeeding, cravings, lactation consultant, medical school, motherhood
Takeaways
Childbirth experiences can vary greatly from person to person.
Pain management options during labor include epidurals and natural births.
Prenatal care is important for monitoring the health of both the mother and the baby.
Postpartum care is necessary to take care of the mother's physical and mental well-being after giving birth. Advocating for oneself during childbirth is important to ensure comfort and address complications.
Breastfeeding may not come naturally and can be physically painful, but seeking support from lactation consultants can help.
Balancing medical school and motherhood is possible, but requires careful planning and support.
Pregnancy experiences can vary greatly, and it's important to be prepared for different scenarios.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Assumptions about Childbirth
05:36 Importance of Prenatal Care
21:18 Experiences with Childbirth and Complications
26:16 Seeking Support from Lactation Consultants
35:18 Discussion on the Timeline of Medical School and Parenthood
Eating Habits, Cravings, and Food Preferences in College
In this conversation, we’re chatting about our eating habits and preferences! Nutrition and finding the right food to fuel our bodies is an everyday struggle, and we’re discussing where Nadia buys her food and the cost of groceries. We also touch on topics such as meal prepping, the nutritional value of different types of food, and the challenges of maintaining a healthy diet in college. We’re ending this episode curious about the reasons behind certain food cravings and the lack of common knowledge about nutrition. We finish this episode with a discussion about our love for chips and the desire to find healthier options.
Takeaways
Trader Joe's is a popular choice for affordable and convenient food options in Boston.
The cost of groceries can vary significantly depending on where you shop.
Meal prepping can be a time-saving and convenient way to ensure access to healthy food.
There is a lack of common knowledge about nutrition and the reasons behind certain food cravings.
Finding healthier alternatives to favorite snacks, like chips, is a common challenge.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction
04:19 Meal Prepping and the Convenience of Healthy Food
09:35 The Quest for Healthier Snacks: Finding Better Chips
How Microaggressions, Othering, Racism & Poor Treatment Leads to Poor Healthcare Outcomes
In this week’s episode, we’re discussing our experiences of being asked about ethnicity and identity, as well as the impact of microaggressions and racism on mental health. We also touch on the sense of community and camaraderie among people of color: feeling a sense of kinship with people of color, exploring the city outside of campus, the importance of good customer service in healthcare, the role of interpreters in healthcare, and the challenges of language barriers in healthcare.
Takeaways
Being asked about ethnicity and identity can be uncomfortable and sometimes offensive
Microaggressions and racism can have a negative impact on mental health
Finding a sense of community and camaraderie among people of color can be empowering
The experiences of being a minority can vary depending on the context and individual perspectives Feeling a sense of kinship with people of color can provide a sense of relief and connection.
Exploring the city outside of campus can help broaden one's perspective and experiences.
Good customer service in healthcare is important for making patients feel heard and cared for.
Interpreters play a crucial role in healthcare, helping patients communicate effectively and ensuring they receive the care they need.
Language barriers in healthcare can lead to miscommunication and poor health outcomes, highlighting the importance of language access services.
Keywords
ethnicity, identity, microaggressions, racism, mental health, community, camaraderie, kinship, people of color, exploring the city, campus bubble, living off campus, customer service, healthcare, interpreters, language barriers
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and New Apartment
06:21Experiences of Microaggressions
10:42 Impact of Microaggressions and Racism on Mental Health
14:51 Finding Community and Camaraderie
23:53 Challenges of Language Barriers in Healthcare
Everything You Need to Know Before Applying to College | Papaya Talk
“It’s not where you are, it’s what you do when you get there.”
In this conversation, we are so lucky to be joined by college admissions consultant Haley Friedman! As a UC Berkeley graduate, she provides us with first-hand insights and tips on the college application process and managing stress. She emphasizes the importance of breaking down the application process into manageable chunks and staying connected to yourself throughout the process. Haley also discusses the changing landscape of standardized testing, and what to know about submitting SAT or ACT scores. We also chat about how to deal with the tension that can arise between parents and students during this time. She suggests setting defined times for college application discussions and seeking the help of a neutral third party if needed.
If you would like to contact Haley Friedman for personal college admissions counseling, her contact info is below!
Website: https://www.haleyfriedman.com/
Email: haleyfriedman1@gmail.com
And here are some amazing, FREE resources and guides we discussed today:
https://www.niche.com
https://www.haleyfriedman.com/blog/so-you-got-into-college-what-happens-now
https://www.collegeessayguy.com/about
Takeaways
Break down the college application process into manageable chunks and set defined times for discussions.
Stay connected to yourself and showcase your passions and interests in your application.
Consider the changing landscape of standardized testing and the importance of other data points in the admissions process.
Seek the help of a neutral third party, such as a college admissions consultant or family friend, to navigate tension between parents and students.
"Showcase what your passions are this far in life."
"Be conscious with your list and apply for a reason."
Chapters
00:00Introduction and Background
06:35The Importance of College Choice
15:17Researching Schools
28:01Navigating Standardized Testing
34:01Managing Tension Between Parents and Students
Keywords college admissions, college application process, stress management, standardized testing, family tension
Changes in Perspective Once You Leave Home
In this conversation, we're talking about Nadia's growth and maturity, her confidence in adult settings, and her experiences with social anxiety. We're reflecting on the things Nadia took for granted at home, such as the weather and family time. Nadia also hares her thoughts on friendships in high school and her perspective on finding a future partner. We end by touching on Nadia's career aspirations in the healthcare field and her desire to become a provider. The conversation concludes with a reflection on new perspectives and future reflections.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction
00:39 Nadia's Maturity and Confidence
09:31 Reverting to High School Self at Home
11:08 Appreciating Home and Family
20:06 Looking for Future Partners
22:12 Future Plans and Career Path
26:31 TV Shows and Enjoying Home
28:02 Choosing a Career in Healthcare
32:08 New Perspectives and Future Reflections
#college #selfawareness #papayatalk #whattoknowbeforecollege #perspective #gratitude
It Will All Work Out in the End: College Decisions
This episode revolves around Nadia's college application and decision process! She discusses her experience with college applications, now two years out and a second year at Northeastern University in Boston, including the challenges of writing essays and completing supplementals. Nadia also reflects on her decision to apply early decision to Barnard and her feelings of relief when she was deferred. She shares her thoughts on choosing Northeastern University and how she believes she could have thrived at any of the colleges she applied to. We also offer advice to high school students, and emphasize the importance of trusting your gut and not settling for a college based on reputation or others' opinions. We also discuss various aspects of college decision-making, including taking advantage of opportunities, considering financial assistance, transferring schools, and the benefits of attending the same school as a sibling. They also touch on the sense of community at Northeastern University, despite what some may claim, and the flexibility of the academic program. Ultimately, it’s important to find a school that aligns with your own personal goals and values. Don’t let rejections deter you from living your dream because after all, rejection is redirection!
Takeaways
College application processes can be challenging, particularly writing essays and completing supplementals.
Applying early decision can provide a sense of relief, but it's important to consider if it's the right choice for you.
Reflecting back, Nadia believes she could have thrived at any of the colleges she applied to.
Trusting your gut and not settling for a college based on reputation or others' opinions is crucial.
It's important to remember that it will all work out in the end and to make the best of any college experience. Take advantage of the opportunities presented by each college decision.
Consider financial assistance and merit aid when making a decision.
Transferring schools is always an option if the current school doesn't meet expectations. Community college is a great option.
Community can be found at any college, even if it may look different from traditional expectations!
Flexibility in academic programs allows for customization and exploration of interests.
Choose a college that aligns with your personal goals and values, as opposed to prestige or where others think would be best for you
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and College Application Season
03:00 Challenges of Writing Essays and Completing Supplementals
06:04 The Decision to Apply Early Decision
10:54 Reflecting on College Choices
15:54 Trusting Your Gut and Not Settling
24:46 Making the Most of College Opportunities
25:39 Considering Financial Assistance in College Decision-Making
26:43 The Option of Transferring Schools
27:23 Benefits of Attending the Same School as a Sibling
32:46 Finding Community at Northeastern University
35:00 Flexibility in Academic Programs
43:31 Choosing a College that Aligns with Personal Goals and Values
Truth or Dare: Smoking, Drinking, and Real Life in College (+ Generational Differences!)
Summary
In this episode, Alyssa and Nadia play a game of “truth or dare” with Alyssa asking Nadia a few unfiltered questions. The questions cover topics such as alcohol consumption, kissing strangers, smoking cigarettes, and using drugs other than marijuana. Nadia answers honestly and shares her thoughts and experiences. Alyssa also answers the questions, reflecting on her own past. The conversation provides insight into their personal lives and experiences, and highlights the importance of open communication.
Takeaways
Open and honest communication can lead to deeper connections and understanding.
Personal experiences and perspectives shape our attitudes towards alcohol, drugs, and risky behaviors.
Social norms and cultural shifts influence our behaviors and perceptions over time.
Public health education and awareness campaigns can impact attitudes and behaviors towards smoking and drug use.
Chapters
Introduction and Truth or Dare Game
Have you ever smoked a cigarette?
Have you ever done drugs other than marijuana?
Have you ever kissed or been intimate with two different people in the same week?
Our thoughts about answering and discussing these commonly taboo topics
Alyssa’s response to the same questions
Reflections on the Conversation
Conclusion
Health Advice for Young Women Headed to College! with Dr. Mira Sinha, MD
Dr. Mira Sinha, a board-certified family physician in Redwood City, shares her insights and advice on various medical topics for young women embarking on independence and college. These are all the things we wish we knew before heading to college! She emphasizes the importance of self-care, staying safe, and knowing when to seek help. Dr. Sinha explains the differences between acetaminophen and ibuprofen, and provides guidance on choosing the right medication for hangovers and cold symptoms. She also discusses when it is necessary to see a doctor for various symptoms and offers recommendations for different healthcare options. In this episode, Nadia and Alyssa discuss accessing healthcare in college and the challenges of finding a local doctor. They also explore the importance of seeking medical care for chronic conditions and the benefits of virtual visits. The conversation touches on the pitfalls of self-diagnosis and the role of online research in healthcare. Finally, they seek advice from Dr. Mira Sinha on pursuing a career in medicine and the importance of being open to change.
Takeaways
It is important to have a local primary care provider for chronic conditions and to set up virtual visits for ongoing care.
If you have a chronic condition that may flare up, it is important to have a local provider who can help manage your symptoms.
Don't let barriers like transportation or fear prevent you from seeking medical care when needed. Make appointments locally and gain experience navigating the healthcare system.
Seek urgent care if you experience symptoms that significantly impact your daily functioning or if you have alarm symptoms like severe pain or difficulty breathing.
While online research can be helpful, it is important to be cautious and not jump to conclusions. Discuss your concerns with a healthcare professional for an accurate diagnosis.
Health anxiety is common, and it is important to communicate your worries to your healthcare provider so they can address them and provide reassurance.
Online research can be a valuable tool for gathering information, but it should not replace professional medical advice. Use it as a starting point for discussions with your healthcare provider.
When considering a career in medicine, be open to change and don't lock yourself into a specific path. Explore different options and be willing to adapt your plans.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Background
01:29 Why Dr. Mira Sinha Chose Medicine and Loves Working with Young Women
06:41 Top Three Pieces of Medical Advice for Young Women
08:15 Understanding Over-the-Counter Medications: Acetaminophen and Ibuprofen
10:06 Dealing with Hangovers and Choosing the Right Medication
13:08 Understanding Cold Medications and When to See a Doctor
21:30 Seeking Medical Care for Chronic Conditions
22:24 Making Appointments and Overcoming Barriers
23:20 Knowing When to Seek Urgent Care
25:38 The Pitfalls of Self-Diagnosis
26:58 Dealing with Health Anxiety
28:02 The Role of Online Research in Healthcare
29:48 Advice for Pursuing a Career in Medicine
Dr. Nishi Bhopal, MD: Sleep for Long Term Wellbeing, Beauty, and Mental Health
Summary
Dr. Nishi Bhopal, a board-certified psychiatrist and sleep specialist, discusses various aspects of sleep and its impact on health. She shares her journey into psychiatry and sleep medicine, emphasizing the importance of prioritizing sleep for college students. The conversation also explores the effects of shift work on sleep and long-term health. Dr. Bhopal provides insights into using phones before bed and offers tips for maintaining good sleep hygiene. The relationship between age and sleep patterns is discussed, along with the significance of consistent sleep schedules. Finally, the conversation touches on the effects of sleep on appearance and skin health. The conversation explores the connection between sleep and the appearance of skin and hair. It discusses the impact of sleep on the repair and rejuvenation of the body, including the skin and hair. The controversy around melatonin, vitamin D, and magnesium as sleep supplements is also addressed. The conversation highlights the importance of quality and dosage when considering these supplements. Additionally, the impact of food and beverages, such as alcohol and sugar, on sleep is discussed. The conversation concludes with a reminder to find balance and flexibility in sleep habits, avoiding rigidity and stress.
Join the women's PJ Party on Zoom March 16th @ 4pm PT / 7pm ET and bring your sleep questions: https://womensleepsummit.ck.page/206d61bece
Takeaways
Sleep quality can affect the appearance of skin and hair, as sleep is a time of repair and rejuvenation for the body.
The use of melatonin as a sleep supplement is controversial, and it is important to choose a high-quality product and use it for the right purpose and in the right dosage.
Vitamin D and magnesium can play a role in sleep, and it is recommended to get tested for vitamin D levels and consider magnesium-rich foods or supplements.
Sugar can negatively impact sleep, while fiber-rich foods can promote better sleep quality.
Finding balance and flexibility in sleep habits is important, as striving for perfection can create anxiety and stress.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Background of Dr. Nishi Bhopal
01:25 Dr. Bhopal's Journey into Psychiatry and Sleep Medicine
07:10 The Impact of Shift Work on Sleep and Health
09:59 Using Phones Before Bed and Sleep Hygiene
11:53 Sleep Patterns and Sleep Needs Across Different Age Groups
21:53 The Importance of Consistent Sleep Schedules
22:44 Effects of Sleep on Appearance and Skin Health
23:42 The Connection Between Sleep and Skin & Hair
26:25 The Controversy Around Melatonin, Vitamin D, and Magnesium
36:02 The Impact of Food and Beverages on Sleep
40:50 The Importance of Balance and Flexibility in Sleep
How Do I Take Care of Myself in College? | Papaya Talk
Summary
In this conversation, Alyssa and Nadia discuss various aspects of self-care in college. They chat about surprises in college life, how to take care of yourself on your own, managing medications, seeking medical advice, personal care products while studying abroad, and the cost of self-care. Nadia shares her experiences and challenges in taking care of herself while navigating college life. They also discuss the importance of establishing care and finding healthcare providers in a new location, like when moving away for college. Overall, the conversation highlights the importance of self-care and the need to adapt to new healthcare systems and routines in college.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Weekend Recap
01:19 Revelations and Surprises in College Life
03:04 Medications and Self-Care
08:07 Different Types of Medications
10:46 Seeking Medical Advice and Establishing Care
13:33 Taking Care of Health Needs
18:18 Personal Care Products and Studying Abroad
20:09 Dealing with Illness Abroad
25:31 The Cost of Self-Care
ABOUT PAPAYA HEALTH & PAPAYA TALK: THE PODCAST
We're chatting about the world of women’s health from one generation to the next. Brought to you by mom and daughter duo Dr. Alyssa-Herrera-Set and Nadia Herrera-Set. Get even more juice at: www.papaya.health
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC53G8A3rEzOzoJen5g0fHlg/
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/papaya-talk/id1615104531
Instagram: @papaya.health https://www.instagram.com/papaya.health
TikTok: @papaya.health https://www.tiktok.com/papaya.health
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4d1TPLv35YkCOgOBXfh5jk
X: @papayahealth https://www.twitter.com/papayahealth
How to Deal With SAD (Seasonal Affective Disorder) | Papaya Talk
In this episode, we’re chatting about what it's like to live in cold weather, specifically in Boston. Nadia shares her experiences and thoughts on the cold after being a California girl her whole life. We also discuss the effects of cold weather on the skin and allergies. We also touch on seasonal affective disorder (SAD), which is a serious challenge for many who are already prone to depression and anxiety. We discuss light therapy as a potential way to mitigate the effects of the cold before jumping into more nuanced experiences with Boston’s cold like the challenges of slipping on ice, skincare, and going to work in this depressing weather. We finish by talking about dressing for parties in cold weather, the theft of jackets at parties (lol), and offer tips for dressing in cold weather. We finish this discussion by exploring tips and tricks for preparing for the emotional and physical challenges of attending college in a cold climate.
Chapters
00:00 Living in Cold Boston
02:17 The Ups and Downs of Cold Weather
03:18 Logistics of Cold Weather
04:05 Effects on Skin and Allergies
07:27 Indoor Temperature and Clothing
08:42 Mood and Grumpiness in Winter
11:37 Seasonal Affective Disorder
14:13 Slipping and Falling on Ice
15:47 Dressing for Parties in Cold Weather
18:04 Taking Ubers in Winter
19:23 Theft of Jackets at Parties
21:28 Tips for Dressing in Cold Weather
23:18 Preparing for College in a Cold Climate
ABOUT PAPAYA HEALTH & PAPAYA TALK: THE PODCAST
We're chatting about the world of women’s health from one generation to the next. Brought to you by mom and daughter duo Dr. Alyssa-Herrera-Set and Nadia Herrera-Set.
Get even more juice at: www.papaya.health Y
ouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC53G8A3rEzOzoJen5g0fHlg/
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/papaya-talk/id1615104531
Instagram: @papaya.health https://www.instagram.com/papaya.health
TikTok: @papaya.health https://www.tiktok.com/papaya.health
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4d1TPLv35YkCOgOBXfh5jk
X: @papayahealth https://www.twitter.com/papayahealth
Gym Culture, Male Gaze, Ozempic, & Toxic Beauty Standards | Papaya Talk
Summary
In this episode, we’re exploring various topics related to fitness, body image, and beauty standards. It begins with a discussion about going to the gym as a woman, Nadia’s experience with the male gaze at the gym, and feeling intimidated by the male-dominated weight room. The conversation then shifts to the use of medications like Ozempic for weight loss and the influence of social media on beauty trends. We also discuss the desire for cosmetic procedures like Botox and lip fillers, as well as the challenges and costs associated with maintaining beauty routines. We conclude with a desire for expert advice on toxic ingredients in beauty products.
Chapters
00:00 Going to the Gym as a Woman
01:30 Feeling Intimidated at the Gym
03:00 Mansplaining at the Gym
04:52 Motivations for Going to the Gym
07:40 Discussion on Ozempic
09:07 Using Medications for Weight Loss
10:34 Extreme Methods for Changing Appearance
16:45 Desire for Botox and Lip Fillers
20:21 The Process and Cost of Eyelash Extensions
22:18 Nail Extensions
23:09 Concerns about Toxicity in Beauty Products
26:01 Negative Experiences with Skincare Treatments
28:04 The Cost and Risks of Botox
29:11 The Need for Expert Advice on Toxic Ingredients
ABOUT PAPAYA HEALTH & PAPAYA TALK: THE PODCAST
We're chatting about the world of women’s health from one generation to the next. Brought to you by mom and daughter duo Dr. Alyssa-Herrera-Set and Nadia Herrera-Set.
Get even more juice at:
www.papaya.health
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC53G8A3rEzOzoJen5g0fHlg/
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/papaya-talk/id1615104531
Instagram: @papaya.health https://www.instagram.com/papaya.health
TikTok: @papaya.health https://www.tiktok.com/papaya.health
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4d1TPLv35YkCOgOBXfh5jk
X: @papayahealth https://www.twitter.com/papayahealth
The Things Nobody Told You About College Life… Internships, Apartment Hunting, & More | Papaya Talk
Summary
In this podcast episode, Alyssa interviews Nadia about her new job as a medical secretary at a community health center in Boston. They discuss Nadia's experience as a co-op student at Northeastern University, the challenges of working full-time (and Nadia’s first big job), and the importance of patient communication. Nadia also shares her thoughts on applying to medical school and making a positive difference in patients' lives. Finally, we also touch on the difficulties of apartment hunting and share funny stories about their past living situations while Alyssa was an undergraduate al UC Berkeley.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and New Job
01:01 Co-op Experience
02:21 Working Full-Time
06:12 Thoughts on Being a Full-Time Worker
07:23 Challenging Situations
08:27 Code Switching
09:30 Communication Challenges
11:20 Deciding on Medical School
13:15 Patient Interaction
14:08 Making a Positive Difference
15:18 Language Barriers
16:28 Impact on Decision to Apply to Medical School
17:19 Apartment Hunting
19:33 Funny Living Situations
22:44 Wrap-Up
ABOUT PAPAYA HEALTH & PAPAYA TALK: THE PODCAST
We're chatting about the world of women’s health from one generation to the next. Brought to you by mom and daughter duo Dr. Alyssa-Herrera-Set and Nadia Herrera-Set.
Get even more juice at www.papaya.health
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC53G8A3rEzOzoJen5g0fHlg/
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/papaya-talk/id1615104531
Instagram: @papaya.health https://www.instagram.com/papaya.health
TikTok: @papaya.health https://www.tiktok.com/papaya.health
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4d1TPLv35YkCOgOBXfh5jk
X: @papayahealth https://www.twitter.com/papayahealth
Dr. Nichole Tyson, MD: Pediatric and Adolescent Ob/Gyn at Stanford | Papaya Talk
In this conversation, we're chatting with Dr. Nichole Tyson, a pediatric and adolescent obstetrician and gynecologist at Stanford. She discusses her journey to becoming a specialist in this field and the reasons why families seek pediatric ob/gyn care. She also explains the basics of the menstrual cycle and how different stages relate to the likelihood of pregnancy, safe sex practices, tips on hygiene and more topics related to women's health. Lastly, she addresses the issue of misinformation and the importance of medical literacy in making informed decisions about reproductive health, and introduces to @gyn.guide on Instagram, an account dedicated to eliminating misinformation around all things pelvic health, run by Stanford residents and med students!
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Background
03:01 Becoming a Pediatric and Adolescent Gynecologist
09:51 Reasons for Seeking Care from a Pediatric and Adolescent Gynecologist
15:37 Understanding the Menstrual Cycle and Pregnancy
21:25 Preventing Pregnancy and Safe Sex Practices
29:33 Hygiene and Concerns
30:41 Normal Variations in Vulvas and Labias
35:41 Use of Birth Control Pills for Non-Contraceptive Purposes
38:51 Misinformation and Medical Literacy
Check out Gyn Guide:
https://www.instagram.com/gyn.guide
ABOUT PAPAYA HEALTH & PAPAYA TALK: THE PODCAST
We're chatting about the world of women’s health from one generation to the next. Brought to you by mom and daughter duo Dr. Alyssa-Herrera-Set and Nadia Herrera-Set.
Get even more juice at www.papaya.health
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC53G8A3rEzOzoJen5g0fHlg/
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/papaya-talk/id1615104531
Instagram: @papaya.health https://www.instagram.com/papaya.health
TikTok: @papaya.health https://www.tiktok.com/papaya.health
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4d1TPLv35YkCOgOBXfh5jk
X: @papayahealth https://www.twitter.com/papayahealth
The Truth About Your Pelvic Floor w/ Dr. Jennifer Kinder PT, MS, DPTSc
Hey everyone, Nadia and Alyssa here! On today's episode of Papaya Talk, we're chatting about all things pelvic floor with the incredible Pelvic Floor specialist Dr. Jen Kinder PT, MS, DPTSc. We're talking about what a pelvic floor pt does, where to find one near you, what a typical pelvic exam is like, changing the system for female athletes, and exercises and techniques you can try literally while watching or listening. We hope you enjoy this episode!
🎙 | Hosted by Nadia Herrera-Set and Dr. Alyssa Herrera-Set PT, DPT
Learn More about Papaya Health's Mission:
www.papaya.health
Instagram - www.instagram.com/papaya.health
TikTok - www.tiktok.com/papaya.health
Facebook - www.facebook.com/wearepapayahealth
Listen on other platforms: 🍑 | https://linktr.ee/papaya.health
Learn more about Dr. Jen Kinder:
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/jen_kinder_pt
https://www.linktr.ee/Info_refitwell
Takeaways
There are different methods of pelvic floor assessment, including internal exams, biofeedback, and external assessments.
Pelvic floor exams are recommended for individuals who have pelvic health issues or symptoms.
Many people are unaware that certain symptoms they experience are not normal and can be addressed through pelvic floor PT.
To find a pelvic floor PT, you can search directories provided by the American Physical Therapy Association
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Background
01:28 Becoming a Physical Therapist Specializing in Women's Health and Pelvic Health
03:11 Personal Connection to Pelvic Health
06:12 Leaking in Young Women and Athletes
08:49 Using Pads and Tampons as a Crutch
10:30 Rehabilitation and Brace for Pelvic Floor
11:25 Changing the System in Female Athletics
14:15 Causes of Leaking and Incontinence
16:36 Experiences with Leaking in Gymnastics
19:08 Exercises and Techniques to Manage Leaking
26:51 Leaking in Males
27:54 Injuries and Pelvic Floor Dysfunction
29:36 Pelvic Floor Physical Therapy Exam
32:17 Different Methods of Pelvic Floor Assessment
34:30 Who Should Get Pelvic Floor Exams?
35:15 Recognizing Pelvic Health Issues
36:47 How to Contact a Pelvic Floor PT
37:30 Telehealth as an Option for Pelvic Floor PT
The Psychology of Substance Abuse in College w/ Dr. Amie Haas
Summary
Today we are joined by Dr. Amy Haas, Professor at Palo Alto University and Senior Lecturer at Stanford University, specializing in college student substance use. We’re discussing the factors influencing addiction and substance abuse in college students. Dr. Haas explains the concept of blacking out and its effects on memory, as well as the potential long-term consequences, emphasizing the complexity of addiction and how addiction affects everyone differently. She also provides guidance for parents on how to address their child's substance use through open communication, finding a balance between intervention, and allowing exploration. We also discusses the potency of cannabis and other substances, especially when mixed with alcohol, highlighting how cannabis has become more addictive due to genetic engineering. She also emphasizes the dangers of unknown substances, particularly with the rise of fentanyl. Dr. Haas warns about the risks of mixing substances, as they can have unpredictable and dangerous interactions. She stresses the importance of knowing the potency and interactions of substances before using them. We finish the episode by sharing harm reduction strategies, such as using fentanyl test strips and carrying Narcan pens. She concludes by encouraging students to have fun in different ways but to be aware of their limits.
Takeaways
Cannabis has become more addictive due to genetic engineering and the use of concentrated forms like dabs.
The rise of fentanyl has made it dangerous to consume unknown substances, as they may be laced with this potent substance.
Mixing substances, such as Xanax and alcohol, can have unpredictable and dangerous effects.
Knowing the potency and interactions of substances is crucial for making informed decisions and reducing risks.
Harm reduction strategies like using fentanyl test strips and carrying Narcan pens can help prevent overdoses and save lives.
Students should have fun in college but also be aware of their limits and know when to stop.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction of Dr. Amy Haas
00:28 Dr. Haas' research on high-risk drinking and drug use in college students
01:53 Dr. Haas' background and journey to becoming a psychologist
05:20 Personal experiences and motivations for studying substance abuse
06:01 Understanding the terms addiction, substance use disorder, and substance abuse
09:18 Exploring the concept of blacking out and its effects on memory
10:41 Factors influencing the likelihood of blacking out
14:19 The potential long-term effects of blacking out
19:19 The complexity of addiction and the absence of a threshold amount
20:26 Individual differences in addiction susceptibility
23:26 How parents can address their child's substance use
28:19 Approaching the conversation with a concerned child
31:57 Finding a balance between intervention and allowing exploration
36:54 The Potency of Cannabis and Other Substances
38:31 The Dangers of Unknown Substances
39:59 The Risks of Mixing Substances
40:56 The Importance of Knowing Potency and Interactions
41:29 Harm Reduction Strategies
42:42 Being Prepared for Opioid Emergencies
43:22 Having Fun in Different Ways and Knowing Limits
Resources:
Free NARCAN:
https://www.goodrx.com/naloxone/narcan-naloxone-at-home-free
https://www.dhcs.ca.gov/individuals/Pages/Naloxone_Distribution_Project.aspx
Fetanyl Test Strips:
https://www.cdc.gov/stopoverdose/fentanyl/fentanyl-test-strips.html
ABOUT PAPAYA HEALTH & PAPAYA TALK: THE PODCAST
We're chatting about the world of women’s health from one generation to the next. Brought to you by mom and daughter duo Dr. Alyssa-Herrera-Set and Nadia Herrera-Set. Get even more juice at www.papaya.health
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The Stress of Holiday Reunions
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Hi Nadia.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Hi.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Um, I feel weird having you back at Northeastern.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, a week at home was a luxury. Uh, it's like a spa break.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Was it? So you're in your sophomore year of college now and you had a week off for Thanksgiving break and it felt like a spa luxury to come home?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, in the sense that like, I have a lot more responsibilities here, so I just, not that I didn't have them there, I just chose to forget about them. Um, I mean, I have a lot more, yeah, a lot more responsibilities here regarding like school and because I was far, far away, it felt like I could just like.
you know, take, like, relax a little bit more. Um... But.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
It's not because you don't have to do things as much like clean dishes and clean your house and stuff, your apartment.
Nadia Herrera-Set
No, I don't know. I guess a little bit because like you guys are the ones like running the house, I guess, instead of me. But maybe in the sense of like everyone else's life, it's like a vacation for me but just me. Like everyone else's lives are like still going. So when everyone else gets has things to do, I don't. Which like...
in a weird sense feels like a vacation for me because I don't have to do things, but it's also weird to be young.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I'm going to go to bed.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I'm wearing your Northeastern sweatshirt because I missed you today. But today, our topic is the stress of like reunions, holiday reunions. I think that's something that I hear.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
people talk about and see people post about online about how it feels sometimes, like the holidays are supposed to be this joyful celebration, reunion with family and friends that love you. And then sometimes it doesn't quite feel that way. And that's like makes things even worse. So how was your, what are your thoughts on that? How was your return home?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, this time I think I've gotten used to returning home, but every time I do, it just feels a little bit weird. Um, like I said before, like everyone, because everyone's, it's not like everyone's life stopped when I moved to Boston. So it's like, I don't feel as connected to it in the, like, I still feel connected to family, but not necessarily home because I'm not there very much.
when I am I'm not there for very long. And then like same with like friends like I'm still in touch with my friends, but you know, we all have like other lives at school and outside of the Bay Area now so it's just like a lot of catching up and
Nadia Herrera-Set
I don't know. It's weird every time I go back, but I feel like a lot of people feel the same way. I mean, I've changed a lot since I've been to Northeastern, or I feel like I have. So it's just like also looking at home in a new perspective is a little bit strange.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
You know, we haven't gotten to talk about how, well, you say you've grown a lot since you've been in Boston. And we haven't gotten to talk about how a lot of people came up to me on the side after seeing you this time, saying that it seems like you're really thriving in Boston, or that you feel you seem happier, or you seem like,
more, I don't know, at ease with yourself or something. Can you explain what that might be about? Like, why is you like, why are people responding to your presence as if there's like a palpable change in your comfort with yourself this time compared to previously?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I don't know. I maybe like, I feel like I came to call like colleges, as people say, like a time to, you know, become not become necessarily become a new version of yourself but push yourself out of like your comfort zone.
And at home, I had like a routine and that routine like never really changed throughout the entirety of my time like in middle school and high school and all that stuff. So I didn't really have like opportunities to like try new things or I don't know meet other people but um
I do feel like I've in some sense like gained more confidence in myself and maybe that's also like just becoming an adult but not that I feel like an adult at all but like I don't know I feel like I sometimes also put on a persona of like trying to act more mature when I'm home too so I feel like well like
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Really? I'm just kidding.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I don't know, I feel like...
maybe looking at it from looking at home from a bird's it's like looking at home from a bird's eye view like i'm not attached to anything except for a family and like my high school friends anymore so everything else is kind of like it's like they don't i don't know they don't really mean that much yeah
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Maybe the things that were that seemed like such a big deal when you were younger because you were like that was all that you had All of a sudden doesn't seem like a big deal anymore. And then it makes you feel at ease with Everything else you come across. It seems like it's a big deal. Like maybe everything isn't really that big of a deal
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right. Right, and also like, I think I've gotten better at like looking at the bigger picture and just, I don't know, new perspectives. I don't know, but that's kinda, I feel like that's interesting to hear.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So what.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, well, I hope that makes you feel happy to hear that you're giving people that impression. So what feels like home? Like when you stepped into your home in Redwood Shores and you're like, ah, home, or when you went back to your apartment in Boston and you're like, home, like which one felt like home?
Nadia Herrera-Set
No, yeah, it does. I just... yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Honestly like honestly both but this is like that's like the first time that has happened
at Northeastern. Not that I didn't feel at home in my other like places that I was living, but I wasn't going to be living there for very long because it was like one semester or like the half semester I did over the summer. So I kind of looked at it as like I'm going to be leaving soon anyways. Like I didn't really get as settled. Whereas I feel like in this apartment, because I knew I was going to be staying here the whole year, I've like made it feel more like home from like the beginning.
when I came back it didn't feel weird and it felt like relaxing and the same thing happens at home too. My room kind of just stays the same so I it feels anytime I step in there it feels like nothing has changed
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So that's all good stuff. What about the hard stuff? A lot of people have a hard time. They dread going to the family party on the holiday, or they dread going to a reunion of friends from high school or elementary school. Did you have any of that?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I didn't have any of that, but I understand, like, there's a lot of anxiety just towards, like, oh, is it going to be awkward? Like, um, yeah, the awkwardness of it all is kind of hard, but, and also, like, not everyone really enjoys, like, that small talk, catching up type of thing. Um.
Especially when it feels like you have like less in common. This is like specifically like friends like if you have less in common with them Then you did before it's I feel like that's kind of hard and Like with family things I Don't know I didn't I didn't feel like I didn't drag going to family things. I think being
Um, away from home for a while, like makes me just like appreciate it more when I get the opportunity to go to like those get-togethers, but Yeah, I think the awkwardness and anxiety that has that like Is connected to it is hard
Alyssa Herrera-Set
It was, I just remember now that you were kind of mentally preparing yourself to see a bunch of your extended family and you were joking about recording your answers because you were anticipating that they were going to ask you the same thing. Like what is it that everybody asks you?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Hmm...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well, I mean, it's not necessarily like because it's like a family thing. Like it's just with everyone. Everyone's everyone asks the same thing because I'm away at college. It's always like, how's college and all that type of thing, which is not. It's not like weird, but I, oh, I. No, I always say that.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
What did you repeat?
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So what's your canned answer? Or did you say something different every time?
Nadia Herrera-Set
I mean, even when I wasn't, even after like my semester in Greece, when I like still wasn't sure how, I hadn't like mentally processed the whole thing yet, I still answered with like, oh, I'm having a lot of fun. Um, I really like it and all that kind of thing. But I am actually having a lot of fun now and I do really like it. So it's less of a half lie, but um, uh, yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Hahaha
I guess you know people don't want to hear like, um, I am having a really hard time. It was really hard for me to adjust. I was kind of lonely and missing home. Like, you just don't really feel like saying that.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, it depended on who I was with. And also, like, I feel like it gets, it all, that's another part of the time where it kind of could get awkward if, like, they, you know, they ask a question or you say something that's, like, not what they expected you to say. And then there's, like, more questions. So kind of, like...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
making it the easiest conversation possible, but that doesn't like, I don't know. I didn't do that with everybody.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, I guess we're lucky that family reunions aren't super dramatic or there's not a lot of fighting. There's not any fighting. We did have a slightly awkward situation though. I mean, maybe more awkward for me and it wasn't that bad. But my mom and my dad and my stepmom were all at
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Oh yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Although my mom and stepmom get along. Were they talking to each other? I don't know. My mom and my dad don't talk to each other at all. Did you, did you feel, was that palpable? Like, did you see that happening?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, I don't know.
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I, I don't know. I don't think I like registered it. I mean, I kind of used like they don't, I know they don't like converse. So I wasn't like expecting them to like sit together, like have a conversation. Um, but yeah, I mean, I guess it's more, it's more of a thing for you because you, you're going to look out for it and you're going to notice it more.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I mean, I am also used to it. What sometimes is weird for me is if I think about how weird it is that my parents don't talk to each other. Like, if you just think about me and your dad not talking to each other on a holiday, it's kind of sucky. But yeah. But we've just gotten used to it at this point. And I'm glad that it didn't result in anything like nobody was mad.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I mean...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, yeah and also like they did it it's not like they couldn't be in the same place so I feel like I don't know our family is getting bigger but it's not that big our house is like not that big so they did have to be in like close proximity so no fighting yeah
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, they were like, I guess, in the next room from each other. Did they sit at the same table for lunch for dinner?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Uh, no. I don't think so. I- I don't... I don't think so. Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, but we got all of them to take a picture together. And it took a little bit of dragging some members out because they were resistant to it. And I don't know if that's because they didn't want to be in a picture together. I'm not sure. But that was really important for me. We never get the entire family, all of my siblings, my mom and my dad, in one picture. That's so.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
ever.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
so rare for me and it was like really important for me. So I'm glad that we were able to make it happen.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, um, yeah, that never happens. Well, I guess not everyone was there, but we, we edited him in.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-mm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, one person, not in the picture, but we edited them in.
Nadia Herrera-Set
and to the back.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah. Well, now you're going to be in school for another two weeks, and then you're going to come right back home. Like, are you feeling that's too soon?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. Um, not... I don't know. I... The next two weeks are gonna be difficult because it's finals and everything, so it's not really like the most fun. Um... But...
I also don't know what I need to do at home. So like, I don't really, I don't know. It's, I've been, I was talking to some of my friends today that like really just like, I don't know, they don't wanna, going home now is like not fun for them anymore, they don't wanna go back. And it like coming back to Boston feels like super relaxing and like, oh, finally I'm, yeah, from Northeastern.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Your friends from North Eastern were saying that they didn't want to go home.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, no, like now they're back here, but like they're glad that they're back. Yeah, I don't know. I feel both. I feel both. I'm like, I'm glad that I'm back, but I also like didn't want to come back because I knew um I have finals and it's like not fun at all.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Um, are some of your friends like having a hard time with, um, or are you having a hard time with defining what is appropriate behavior when you're at home? Like when to come home? Like are some people like annoyed because their parents are super strict when they're at home and they can do whatever they want when they're at school, that type of thing?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I mean I haven't like really talked about that much. I feel like maybe that was more of a thing like last year because it's like both for me like for us and for our parents like it's hard to know like where the boundaries are when you're back home again but I don't know.
You kind of like you go home for like family and you're like close friends from high school anyways so it's not necessarily like I in my head I know whenever I'm doing like here in Boston is not really going to be happening in um in at home so I like I've already set the difference before I get before I step before I step in the Bay Area.
Hehehe
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I actually didn't experience that. I felt like I was going out with my friends in college, at like on campus and around campus. And then when we come home for the holidays, then I would like go out with my high school friends and like.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, I mean, I did over the summer. I don't know. It's like, it's different. It's like, it's weird. And I also don't know the Bay Area like that. So like the, like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't see the, yeah, like it's, I don't look at it the same way. So it's...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
where to go out.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Oh, that's true. And you don't really have a lot of good friends that are going to college here. Your friends...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, so everyone is like, we're all in different parts. We're actually none of us are, aren't like, most of us are not home, so it's at all, so it's very, none of us are used to it. And I don't know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, and my friends all went to school nearby.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, so it's like, I guess I can hear it from like the great men. I can ask other people that do go to school close, but I know it feels weird. But I guess, I don't know, most of my friends here at Northeastern live, actually all my friends at Northeastern are from the East Coast. So what, however, like you felt in college, just a little bit, how they feel. Cause you know, they know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Like how to like home and school is very close, but for me, it's very different.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm, and then your friends too like all of the friends that you would go out with back at home None of them are going to school nearby. So then none of you guys know what to do around here
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right, right. Yeah, so it's interesting.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
All right, so what's what are you gearing up for? You have two weeks of finals.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well, not... Well, I guess, yeah, kind of two weeks of finals. Um, yeah. But actual finals week is like, like the December 11th, December 16th, like that week. But my first final's on the 6th, and I really need to start studying, but I really, really don't want to.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Well, you're almost there. I mean, that's the nice thing about going to school, like things end and then start over again. Like in regular adult life, it just keeps going.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. But then also like, oh yeah. But next semester I'll be on co-op too, so it's like...
that is I guess I'll have a break from school for a long time. It's just gonna be really interesting.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Oh, yeah. That'll be fun. I was just thinking about how you're going to be probably really tired. It's going to be really weird, I think, for you to have to go to work from eight to five or whatever, just like 40 hours of being like on is different than like two hours of class and then a break and then two hours of class and then a break.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, it is. Yeah, but I feel like with like classes too, I'm doing homework for a long time. So like that whole time when I'm off of work is when I would be doing my homework anyways. So like that's gonna be different and I'm gonna I feel like Yeah, we'll see what happens. Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
You're excited not to have homework? All right. It was nice talking to you. I feel I don't know why I feel sad that you're gone, even though I just saw you yesterday, and then you're coming back in two weeks. But I think it's because that same reason that everybody feels like.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Nice talking to you too.
Nadia Herrera-Set
and I'll be back. Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
you know, oh, you're doing really, she's doing really well, and she's thriving, she's happy. It's like a good thing, right? But then it makes me feel like even more, like you have a whole life away from here. That's probably it. Yeah. All right. Bye.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. Well. Bye.
Overwhelm, Anxiety, Hangxiety, and Seeking Therapy
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Sometimes I feel like our talks are all about exposing you and what's going on in your personal life. Sorry in advance.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, it's okay. No, I'm okay with it. I like sharing. Yeah, makes it more personal.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Okay, hopefully it's helpful for other people.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah. Okay, so today, because it is end of November, or no, mid November, we're going into Thanksgiving break. And you probably had some midterms coming up. Or just had some midterms. And I have some big news and projects coming up in my life too. And so this has
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
And when sometimes you're so obsessed or worried or nervous about something that you can't literally think or perform the way that you want to, or your whole life is filtered with some kind of panic haze.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Yeah. I that is something that I, as you know, I've struggled with that for a long time. And it like because I'm the type of person to just get stressed out really easily over like the littlest things.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Does that resonate with you at all?
Nadia Herrera-Set
And yeah, it is Thanksgiving break. We had midterms like at the, before Halloween, but that doesn't mean like the tests stopped. So like I've had like a bunch of like projects and tests before Thanksgiving break, and then I'll have finals before I go home.
Um, so yeah, it's stressful. It's also like starting to get cold and I haven't been home in a while. So it's, it's just a lot and everyone, everyone feels like they need a break.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah. So have you ever like been in the middle of a test and felt panic, like you couldn't figure out the answer and all of a sudden you were worried?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I mean, in a general sense of like, as like just not knowing the answer. Yeah. But I would say that my test anxiety doesn't usually happen during the test. It'll happen like the night before, meaning like I'm studying the night before. Um, and that's when it feels like I just stay up all night and I have to like do all of this right now.
because either I don't know it or I've like procrastinated too long. So like that's when like the panic attacks and like anxiety sets in. But while I'm taking the test, I mean, yeah, if it's a hard question, I'm going to like get nervous. But I feel like I don't have that type of test anxiety, which I'm fortunate not to have, because I feel like
It really, it really hurts people when they have to, when their grade depends on this like one thing. But I would say that does only apply for me in school because I do get performance anxiety when I'm like competing and that could also happen, and that could happen during competition, like during a routine.
Alyssa Herrera-Set (
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So do you like, well, okay, let's take a step back. So the night before a test, you're worried because you've procrastinated or you feel like you don't know the material enough and you say that you get like anxious. What does that look like? Like, how do you respond to that? And how does that feel inside you?
Nadia Herrera-Set
So it depends.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I'm, I get very panicky. I feel like I can't do anything but like study for the test. Like I can't take any breaks and I can't, like, I need to stay up late. Even if I have to wake up early so that I can finish it. And like, I don't know, it can get to the point where I just feel like so overwhelmed that I feel like crying or like, I, this just happened.
on Tuesday. No, yeah, on Tuesday. And I stayed in a library for 10 hours. And I only left to get food. And I mean, that doesn't mean I was like, working, working like the entire time, but I was in that library for 10 hours. And
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Hehehehe
Nadia Herrera-Set
I don't know, that's not very healthy at all, but that's what my anxiety tells me to do. I need to like, I can't sleep, I can't do anything else.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So it's one thing to like take that situation and go, I need to study, so like I need to do well on this test. So I have to be in the library for 10 hours. It's almost like a punishment or a prescription or something like that. So that's one thing versus another feeling, which might be like you can't think about anything else. You can't eat.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
All right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
you cannot literally fall asleep because you're thinking so much about the test. So that's why you're in the library. You know what I mean? So is it more like you've prescribed 10 hours in the library for yourself or is it more like, well, I can't sleep, I can't have a good time, I can't enjoy anything else, so I might as well be in the library and do that.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. It's like... yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
No.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I didn't plan on staying in the library for 10 hours. That's just how it happens. And then like really didn't need to happen because I could have just not procrastinated that much. But I just, I don't know, it feels better to me. And then sometimes when you get home late and you still you have to get up and you have to wake up for your tests next morning, then I have like anxiety that I'm not going to wake up in time for the test. So it's like just a whole bunch of things. Um.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So do you feel like staying up actually helps? Like you're like, oh, it's a good thing I stayed up and barely slept. Or do you feel like you just kind of made things worse by studying for so long that you didn't sleep?
Nadia Herrera-Set
well
Nadia Herrera-Set
I don't regret it because of how I felt during the test. Not that I thought the test went really well, I just feel like if I hadn't done it, I would have felt a lot worse and it would have been really bad. And I've also found recently, this wasn't always the case, I could, I used to be able to wake up early and study and stuff, but now I realize that when I try to wake up early here, I just end up staying in bed and not.
working like I just it just doesn't work in my favor. So staying up late has been is like the better option of the two bad options for me. But I don't know. I don't regret it because the test can have gone a lot worse, but that's not a healthy thing. This is not a healthy study habit.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
be where you.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I mean, have you ever found, this has happened to me. I have found that sometimes when I'm working on something super late at night when I'm tired, it takes me forever. Like I'm trying to write an email to somebody and I just like, my words are just not coming out. I'm so tired that like, it's sometimes like gibberish. And then if I wake up in the morning and try to do that, like finish that task, it can like happen super fast. Like it's like so much easier to do.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I guess it's like if you're writing something. I could see that, but I was doing organic chemistry. So it was like my brain was already working and I didn't come home because I knew that if I came back to my room that I'd get distracted.
Like that transition when you're studying is not always the best. So I just, and they just remodeled the fourth floor of the library. So it's like all new and exciting with couches and all this stuff. So it's like, like I had a new environment to study in. So that also helped. Um, but yeah, yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
nice.
Okay, so I don't have... I mean, we're lucky to not have too much test anxiety, but I do remember the first moment that I felt panicky during a test. It was weirdly, really specifically during my junior year of high school Spanish final. And I had never felt that before, where all of a sudden it's felt like this, like, wave or wash of... I don't know, like...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Ugh.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I guess a panic. I don't know how else to call it, but like a wave came over me, like a feeling came over me. And it was just like, it's almost my whole body or like brain and body were like almost like buzzing and in a state of like haziness almost. And I just took a moment to acknowledge it and I was like, whoa, that's weird. And luckily I was able enough to realize what was happening and then wait for it to pass, which it didn't take too long.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
All right.
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
And then I just went on, but I was like, whoa, that's strange. And then the first time, and then when the pandemic happened, or with the start of the pandemic, everything was all unclear. I found myself waking up at like 5 in the morning, like super awake. And I was like, that's weird. I don't need to be awake because I couldn't go to work, right? I was like, oh, that's weird. Am I waking up this early because I just
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I'm so rested because I'm not working. And then I realized, oh, I think that's anxiety waking me up at 5 in the morning. It's like a different color of that wave was over me, just super awake and ready to go. It almost felt good, but then it wasn't good because it was at 5 o'clock in the morning. Have you ever felt that?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right, yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. I mean, I feel like, you know, I panic like really quickly and easily. And so maybe like I do have test anxiety, but I feel that in a lot of other situations in my life. So it feels like it feels normal. I would say like,
I'm just like thinking back to my test I just took right now. When I don't know something, I like sit like I'll sit there for a second. If I really don't know it, like I'm just going to either have to come back to it, like guess and put a random answer down or I don't know. And it's and then like when I leave that test, I'll be like stressed out about it. But another thing that I feel like after I left that test is like I feel like I have
blacked out during the test. Like I'll leave and be like, I don't remember anything I did and I don't remember. Can't even look up the questions because I don't remember the questions anymore. But
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Oh, that's never happened to me before. Like you just black out.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, well, it's like I leave the test room and like, suddenly, I don't remember any of the questions I just like wrote. And then I'm like, well, hopefully, you know, hopefully it works out.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Do you eventually remember them, or did they stay out of your head forever?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, they, well, they stay out of my head forever. Unless it's like one that I really like wasn't sure about, then like, I guess that one stays in. But, um, with gymnastics, I guess it's a different type of like panic. There's the panic that I felt like when I knew I wasn't prepared and I like had to do something during practice that like...
I don't know. Yeah. And then there's like anxiety before competing. I've also felt like I can do it really well when no one's, this is primarily with gymnastics of like, I can do it really well, something really well, and then like, someone will point it out and everyone will start watching and then I'll like fall on my face. And like, not like a fear of it, like it's actually happened multiple times.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Was scary or you felt like your life was at stake? Your health was at stake?
Nadia Herrera-Set (12:55.188)
Um, like I just like when the pressure's on me, it, it just doesn't work out. And I don't know, but probably because like I put that pressure on my extra pressure on myself to do it really well. But I don't know. I feel that type of panic when I'm competing.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I feel like I was just talking to my colleague, I was talking to Tanya about how some people really thrive and do well in an emergency situation or a kind of stressful situation. And some people kind of just crumble and can't act. And she said about me, she's like, I feel like.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
you, Alisa, can really work well in an emergency situation. If you're my emergency room doc, you'd be OK. And I was like, I don't, I totally don't agree with that. I feel like I wouldn't do well when having to think quickly. But I think the difference, I think she would do well in that kind of situation. But I think the difference for me is there are few situations that I think are stressful and panicky. So then it's
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm.
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
What people think that I flourish well under stress, but I think it's just that I don't interpret a lot of situations as stressful. You know, like, I'm like, this is okay, we're okay here. You know? Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, yeah. Just used to it, yeah. I do not think I work well in like emergency situations and I would not do well in the emergency room because my stress and anxiety can blind my judgment, which I guess is something I should work on, but I can just.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
That's what I think about myself too. It's something I should work on. I'm actually like emergency responder certified. So like I've taken the course so many times, but I say to myself all the time, I would be really bad in that situation. But I wonder if I really like worked on it, because I have the skills, I have the knowledge. I just maybe I need to be in the situation a lot, and then I'll get better at it or trust myself more. Sometimes you have to have enough like successful.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
um, rounds of something in order to start to feel like, oh, I think I can do this.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. I think another... This is like another form of like panic and anxiety and like a different form is like in social situations.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I've like, I've gotten better at it, but I do have a lot of social anxiety and like, there's that type of panic of like when you're with a group of people you don't know, or even with a group of people that you do know, and you like, you like say something or you don't know what to say, then you like sit there and you're like, wait, I shouldn't have said that or like, I don't belong here. So what am I doing here? There's I've, I mean, especially in college, obviously, like I felt that a lot. So
there's that type of like panic I'm gonna run away and like, I don't know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, that's interesting. So your dad and I were talking about how, now I'm going to expose him, he can't be here to defend himself. How he can be like, so his social anxiety sometimes shows up before an event, before he goes someplace, he's not necessarily looking forward to it, trying to think about who's going to be there, what are their names?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
He's strategizing ahead of time how he's going to manage the situation. I'm usually kind of optimistic about the situation, and I just kind of go into it. But then sometimes after, I kind of perseverate or think a long time about the things that I said to people while I was at the party. And should I have said that differently? And what kind of impression did I leave? And second guessing. So I would, is that like, that's not really in like post?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
like.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
event anxiety? I don't know what that's called.
Nadia Herrera-Set
It's just social anxiety. Your anxiety over... Yeah. Um, I think like...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Social regret.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, that's something I really had to work on and I feel like it wasn't something that I wanted to work on but in College, I feel like at home I don't know. Maybe i'm just like making assumptions. But like when I was at when I'm at home account my friends at home are more Outgoing than more extroverted than I am. Whereas like my friends I feel like um
I feel like when I'm with my friends that I've made at Northeastern, I've made a lot of friends that are like me, which is really nice, but then that means when we're in certain situations, and you have to go talk to someone, or you have to, I don't know, be the first one to walk to a door. I end up being the one to do it, so I've forced myself to... I don't know if it's to be more confident or just to not care.
Maybe they go hand in hand. But I'll feel like a lot of anxiety beforehand and then like, wait I shouldn't have done that. Um, or in the morning after. Like the morning after I go out is probably the worst ever.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm. Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
You're like laying in bed thinking about all the things you did and said.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, it's called anxiety and I...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Oh, I've never heard of that term. Hang-xiety.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I... well I suffer from it really badly.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Well, that's a whole other thing, though. When you're intoxicated and not thinking clearly and acted in ways that you would have if you had, like, full judgment and control, that's a different thing.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. But it's, it's not even it's that and then also like, when I'm in those situations, it's a social situation where I like try to act more, like confident and like more outgoing than I actually am. So then when I look back at it.
It's like, oh my goodness, I can't believe I did that. But like, it's a normal thing to do, but I just like, talk to someone and I wouldn't have done that if, you know, if I was like at school. Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
There's a beauty about going to college, going away to college, right? Like you get to try on a bunch of different identity and personality outfits. Like today I'm going to be.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, but then when I go home, then I'm like, feel really weird. Like, I'm going home tomorrow and anytime I go home, it just feels really, I don't know how to act. I, it's a really strange feeling. A panicky feeling.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Okay, can we bring up your AP test?
Nadia Herrera-Set
No, we can't. We actually can't. Well, actually I have told other people, I can... I don't even know. I don't even know what I'm... What I... Like how am I supposed to... Well, anyways, if you took AP tests in 2020, they were online and long story short.
I was really stressed out about it and it was my first AP test, it was AP Euro and I just got really stressed out and it was really bad and I was and then I had to there was some events happened and I had to redo the test because I didn't turn it in and then it was just really bad and I was screaming crying.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Oh my gosh, I had... Okay, first of all, going into the exam, the whole week before, you kept, like, you were so nervous about it. I wasn't sure why, but you were so nervous about this test. I mean, it was a hard time, right? We're talking, was this 2020? No, this was 2021, right? Because the...
Nadia Herrera-Set
for probably hours.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Oh.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
No, it was 2020.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Oh, OK. So it was your sophomore year, second semester sophomore year. So we're talking like April, May, or whatever, 2020. Everything's online. Everything is crazy at this time. The whole world is anxious about just the baseline is anxiety. And then you take this, your first AP test. And I don't know what story you had said in your head about the importance of this test to your whole entire life and identity. But there was a whole week of you being so worried about it.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
in a really weird way, because you've always done pretty well in school. So I was like, I wonder why she's so nervous about this test. And she keeps, I was a little bit worried because you kept saying that it was going to be bad. And I would, you know how sometimes they say, if you say it's going to be bad, it's going to be bad. You know, like you're putting that too much of that energy in the universe. So then you go to take the test and you're in your room for however many hours taking the test online. Oh, I'm not supposed to say it. I'm not supposed to say it.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
You can't say everything. It's bad. Well... Hehehehe No, well... I didn't actually say it. It's actually not that bad, but I can't expose myself that much.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Okay, nevermind, I thought you just said it.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Okay, well, long story short, from a mother's point of view, your response after the test was very scary for me to witness.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I panicked.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, I think sophomore year was all like a really that was for a lot of different reasons. That was like a weird time for me, like mentally and emotionally, especially with COVID. And yeah, it's really panicky. The whole first semester like, I guess it's freshman year too.
I was like crying every single gymnastics practice, every single practice I went to I cried. And like, that's not normal. So like it was already like a hard time. And I guess I did have test anxiety then. And from then on it's been like better. But
Alyssa Herrera-Set
What would you say to that freshman Nadia that was crying every day in practice now? Would you be like, it's gonna be okay? Or would you be like, you should stop doing gymnastics now.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I mean I had the opportunity, I could have left if I, like I could have quit if I wanted to but I didn't. So I don't know if freshman year me would have really wanted to stop, I don't know. I think she needed a break and I think I just took things way too seriously. It was like, that was like my whole life. I guess that's how I felt with like school too. I mean it was my whole life, school and gymnastics. But.
I don't know. I don't really know what I would say to myself in that situation. I just like things weren't working in at practice and so I reacted physically. And I was getting hurt a lot. So
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, maybe actually you weren't eating enough.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Ah, no, I probably was eating enough. I don't know, I was just anxious and stressed.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Sleep, maybe not sleeping enough. I don't know. Now that I hear you talk about it, like, yeah, just stressed. You know, you stopped doing gymnastics at the end of your senior year, and at the rest, around the same time, Lucy stopped too. And she had her own reasons for stopping after the end of her sophomore year. She was saying it wasn't fun anymore. But I wonder if part of her felt like she had to stay at gymnastics to, like, look out for you. Like, if you...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
could see your sister crying every day at practice, you might be worried and then like think that you should be around just in case.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I wanna...
I wanna be, I wanna bring her on the podcast to ask her. In my opinion, I don't think that's why she stayed. I don't think like, I don't know. We weren't in the same group then. She might like, I don't know, we should ask her, but. I don't know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
We should bring your coach on and ask her about you crying at every practice.
Nadia Herrera-Set
There.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, I was bad. But, and I also, I tried to see a therapist then too. That's just like, it didn't work for me. I feel like now, like I don't see a therapist now, but if I, now looking back on it, I really approached the therapy as like, in a strange way that like wouldn't have helped me. Like, I don't know. Not that therapy was a failure, that like I didn't approach it in the way that I should have.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Like it was a failure to go to the therapy?
Alyssa Herrera-Set
What was that? How did you approach it and how should you have?
Nadia Herrera-Set
You know, like I feel like, I mean, I don't really remember that much, but like, I don't feel like I probably told her everything. And I also don't feel like, I felt like this is like a one time, like it, you know, I do remember, I think I had like two or three sessions, but like with different people. So I don't know why like, I made, I don't know why I did it like that. It was just.
I don't know. I was, I guess I was a lot, it's a lot different personality wise that I feel like I was a lot less like open to share and now I feel like I just talk and talk and talk so it would be a different experience now.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, I think I told you that my friend said that like, going on this podcast is kind of like, therapy and our podcast is the therapist. It's like, it's like a controlled conversation because we know where it's being recorded.
Nadia Herrera-Set
A little bit.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Um, well, okay, about your therapy that you went to when you were younger, maybe it would have taken just some time to build, like, trust and connection. And I think that you were in a situation where you received care, didn't really promote, like, weekly sessions, because you were...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Totally. Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I mean, to be specific, you were at a Kaiser HMO, and maybe you weren't seeing somebody that was in an urgent situation. So they prioritized your appointment maybe a little bit less and wanted to encourage you to maybe use the tools that they were helping you in between, and then practice that, and then come back. It's a style that probably works for a lot of people, but maybe didn't work for you at the time.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, I feel like I definitely didn't. I didn't approach it as like a long-term thing. I approached it as like a one-time thing that is gonna work after one time, which obviously it's not. And I don't know, I feel like being in...
I guess it's probably, it's not because of like the people I turn myself with, but just because it's high school and we don't talk about it that much. But I feel like when I was, like before I came here, I didn't, I wasn't around as many people that did therapy or like, you know, we're on, you know, anxiety, like medication or things like that. But now being in college, I feel like the majority.
of my friends have either seen a therapist or are talking to one. And not because like things are like really terrible, but it's just like, they know that it helps them and they have like a relationship with the person that they're talking to. So it feels like, you know, they can actually get something out of the conversation. Um, so in that way, I feel like maybe my approach to therapy is like, it has changed because I've
Like I'm around more people that like have seen the benefits from it. Um, but there's also like.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
If you needed therapy, like if you wanted to pursue mental health support, would you tell your dad and I ahead of time or would you just go seek it yourself?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well, I've had like friends try to go do it at school. They have it at school. But I don't know if it was like the best experience. So I'd probably just ask you guys. I don't really feel, I don't feel like, I don't know. Some people, yeah, unfortunately some people do, but like I feel like I would just ask you because then I could.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
stigma or shame about asking for it.
Nadia Herrera-Set
you know, find one that actually fits me instead of like trying to find a free one on campus, you know, like it's just different. Um, yeah, I don't know. Therapy is good. I don't, I feel like I should. I feel like, I don't know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, it really, it's a nice thing. Like I didn't seek a lot of therapy before. I don't know if that's just like there wasn't a need or if that wasn't, if it was because there was like stigma attached to it or maybe because of the money associated with it. But then I did see somebody last year. Last year? Yeah, last year. And it was so nice. She was so lovely.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
And it felt really good to talk to somebody that would... Like, people always say, like, I can talk to my friends, I can talk to my family. It's really different to talk to somebody that you're paying to listen to you and that's not part of your life and maybe can say things that make you feel like... Like, their responses make you feel heard, you know? And...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right, right.
Right, right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I don't know, I didn't see her for very long. It just like, it felt good to do it. And then I recently recommended this therapist to somebody else who also had never seen a therapist. She's a little bit older than me, had never seen a therapist. And she's like, I just, you know, it's so hard to go out there and find somebody. Like, I don't know if I'm gonna find the right fit, blah, blah. I'm like, just see this person, she's really nice. And I saw that person that I recommended the therapist to.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm
Alyssa Herrera-Set
this past week and she's like, oh my God, it's so nice to talk to her. So it felt good to go to therapy, have it feel good and then pass on the permission and information to somebody else to go seek a therapist. And I was so glad that I could give somebody that I thought was a good resource.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, yeah. That is, I don't know. I've never, I have like the amount of like pros that I hear that they're being comparison to like, like one bad experience. I feel like, like everyone should try. But I, it does, yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
That's a good point. Yeah, but it does cost money too, right? So it's like one bad experience plus it costs you, whatever it costs you. It's hard sometimes when like maybe like part of your, the reason why you need some support is because you're having some financial issues, you know? It's, yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Right. Yeah. It's also hard, especially with like being in college. It's like, I feel like, well, but I mean...
I guess maybe in when I tried to go to therapy before it didn't really, I wasn't really open with everything that was happening. Also because like, I just felt like whatever I was feeling wasn't really that like whatever was like causing my anxiety wasn't that valid. And so you ended like not sharing as much which and now in college, like you don't want to have to tell your therapist like all these things. So then you just end up like, I'm just not gonna, I'm not gonna see him anymore. I'm not gonna see her anymore.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I mean, maybe that's why it takes time, because it takes time to get to the point where you're like, all right, fine, I'm just gonna tell you the things.
Nadia Herrera-Set
because like, yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, but...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Anyway, I'm glad you're managing your panic and anxiety and overwhelm in a relatively productive way in a way that's working for you right now. But if you do need mental health support, yeah, you know, you can tell your dad and I.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Alright, nice talking to you. That was a long one. It just flowed.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Nice talking to you too. Yeah. And I'll see you literally tomorrow.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yay. All right, bye.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Okay, bye.
For gymnasts (& athletes) who leak… + returning to gymnastics in college | Papaya Talk: The Podcast
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Hey Nadia, I'm loving your headphones and hoodie look. You're looking kind of hip hop.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Hello.
Nadia Herrera-Set
It's really, really cold here.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I know we're sure in the video we're going to be showing the difference between California and Massachusetts. It's pretty warm here right now, not hot, but warm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I'm going to go to bed.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, it's winter. It is. Okay. Well, it's 52 degrees, but it's like windy out. And yesterday was like, I had a class at nine 15 and it was 30 degrees. It was winter. Um, so I had to.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
What's the temperature over there?
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I just looked at a map this morning that talked about how it's going to be an El Nino winter, and it showed where there's going to be more snow than usual and less snow than usual. And in Tahoe, where I go for snow, there's going to be more snow than usual, and in Boston, there's going to be less snow than usual.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Uh huh.
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Oh, perfect.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I guess that doesn't mean it's not gonna be cold.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well, it's gonna be cold, but like the snow makes it worse sometimes. And I'm slipping and sliding everywhere and it's just really annoying.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
All right. So I love how we're kind of like pushing into this next episode. I'm excited to ask my questions, but I know that you're not that excited about it. So I just turned on recording me to start going. But let's start with a soft entry. How's gymnastics going? You didn't do gymnastics for basically 18 months.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Ha ha
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So you did it your whole life and then took a break. Actually want to hear about that a little bit. Like what made you decide to after 18 months start gymnastics again? And like, did you ever during that 18 months think that you were going to go back to gymnastics?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, no. Well, I obviously I missed gymnastics a lot during those 18 months, but it, um, I've been doing it my whole life, so I really needed that break. And I really enjoyed having that break. It was like, it made me realize just how much anxiety, like, just how it really, like, how gymnastics affected me mentally and emotionally. I mean, and physically, obviously, but.
It was good to have that break and then as you know like over the summer before this semester I was really against like joining the club gymnastics team not because like I Thought it was gonna be bad, but just because I know I really didn't want to like do gymnastics like that ever again
But then as I said, I think I said another episode that I just like ended up going to the interest meeting for the gymnastics club and everyone was super nice and it was super low commitment in comparison to my other, like my previous gymnastics experience. So that really incentivized me to just go to the tryouts and...
It's like really funny when I talk to like my teammates about it because they're like, Oh, did you like train over the summer for this or did you do any? I was like, no, I literally didn't know gymnastics. I did gymnastics once and I barely did anything. And I just showed up to these tryouts. It wasn't like what you would normally expect to try out to be like. But obviously, I was there doing my skills and I just kind of went for it, which is kind of crazy. But.
I don't know. It was, and then I got on the team. I got on the competitive team. And then after the, and also like after the tryouts, it was like, although I was so against joining before, like now, like if I didn't get on the team, I knew I was going to be upset. So like, yeah, my head was like, now I really need to like get on. But then, and then I did. And then it kind of hit me like I'm, now I'm like back in it again. Like I'm going to have to compete next semester and like for the next four years. But it's a lot of fun. And I feel like I tell like all my like teammates, like I feel like it's healing my like gymnastics trauma from before just because like this is literally all on my terms. Like I am doing whatever I want, which is a lot of fun.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So, you know, in case your old coaches are listening to this episode, maybe we need to clarify like, you know, what you mean by old traumas so that, you know, they don't feel like they've been thrown under the bus.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Clarify.
Nadia Herrera-Set
No, I mean, like, just like, I don't know. I a lot of the times, like throughout the years in like middle school, high school, I like nothing to do with like it didn't always have to do with like coaches or like anything that I did at practice in general. But like the anxiety before entering the gym was a lot. And like that was all I was thinking about was competitions or what I was going to be doing next practice or like.
what went wrong in different practice. And it was, it's tiring mentally. And also like to be a competitive J.O. gymnast, there's like disciplines that go with that. And you can't like, it's not always gonna be a lot, like all fun and games because you just, like you have to prepare for these competitions. Whereas like for the club gymnastics, you still have to prepare but.
There's lower stakes and I don't know. There's like just a different feel to it and it's fun to kind of be my own coach but then also like go back to what I was so comfortable with before. I don't know. It's a weird feeling but.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I'm going to have to interview again right before your first competition or after your first competition and see how you feel. But it sounds to me like a lot of what you're talking about is trauma when you were younger in gymnastics was some of the feeling that you put on yourself. It was your environment and the situation.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Oh yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Thank you.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
and the intensity of the coaching and the intensity of just a sport, the vibe of the sport in general. But it was like also how you interpreted the situation and the things that were going on in your head. So how are you dealing with that now? Is it just a change of environment and vibe that makes the stories in your head change? Or are you...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Are you consciously changing the stories? Why isn't it as anxiety provoking when you go into practice now?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Probably both. I don't know. I get to choose. It's only two days a week. Two hours per practice. That's four hours a week. In comparison to like 20 hours a week I did before. I get to choose when I get to go. I don't know. There's just like...
new idea of like I get to choose. I have a choice. It's not. I mean I did have a choice before. But I was always in my head about missing practice and like I don't know doing you want to be perfect for your coaches too. So but this time I'm just do like I'm doing well for me. I don't know. It's like it's like I think it's mostly me.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
hehe
Nadia Herrera-Set
I was talking about it out loud. No, he does, but like, it's a different dynamic. That's another thing. The dynamic is a lot different. Like, the coach is there obviously to coach and to like be there to help us out, but he's like, he's not coaching the same way that like a JO coach is coaching you.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Does your coach, you have a coach now, does he not care how well you do?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Like he's on the on the in the background basically obviously watching like a consultant. Yeah, and the president of the club like in the whole like eward of the club are girls on the team and those are technically the people who are also consulting so it's like You get to be like friends with you know, like it's a whole different dynamic, which is super interesting Yeah
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Like a consultant.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, there's like an age dynamic to right like when you were doing gymnastics, you keep seeing J. O. which for the listeners out there that means Junior Olympic and that was the way that it used to be called when Nadia was in gymnastics, the people that are like progressing through the kind of more competitive levels in gymnastics. It's now called developmental. So anyway,
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
development.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
So when you started what you call J.O., you were little, like nine years old, your first competition season. And you started gymnastics when you were like zero, basically. And then your first competitive season was when you were nine years old, then your coach is like in his or her 30s or older. And there's a
Nadia Herrera-Set
Uh-huh.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
definite like feeling there of like, okay, you're older than me, you're like, I'm supposed to respect you because you're my coach, and because you're older than me. And, you know, you're me. Yeah. And now
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Yeah, it was like a power thing. And then growing up with the same coaches, although like I'm getting older, like the power dynamic is still there from when I was little. And like now there's like, there's a power dynamic, but it's almost, I don't know. There's like, I don't know. It's different being like, bossed around by your friends.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, I think also four hours makes a big difference. When you're little and your 20 hours of your week is gymnastics, that makes up like your entire identity. And now you're an adult with like lots of things going on, lots of things like, you know, that you would associate with as shaping your identity, defining your identity. You are only doing it for four hours. So it's not like your everything, whereas before it was basically your everything. So that's kind of nerve wracking too.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right. Exactly.
Hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Right. Yeah. And there's like a team dynamic too. And like when you're growing up, like there's a lot of competitiveness between you and your teammates and you obviously you want to win. And I mean, gymnastics never really came easily for me. So it was never really like the best on the team. But when I like, there's a very competitive nature of being on a gymnastics team and in a different way than it is in other sports. And here in the club team, I feel like I can, like there's less of that. Like everyone just wants to have fun and to do well. So we're gonna like all support each other, which I guess also is an age thing since we're all in college, but yeah.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Right. And I thought also before you are competing for lots of different reasons, but I guess one of them is like your thoughts are you're trying to get to this certain level, like level 10 or elite by a certain age so that you can go to college gymnastics. And now where you're at, it's not like you're doing the gymnastics to get to something else. You're already there.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right, right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right. And also the level that we're competing at, well the thing is I need to work up to my skills, but the level we're competing at is lower than the level that I ended up at. However, I still don't have those skills. So it's a whole, I think it's also kind of a fun game for me to be like, wow, all these things that I thought were easy before are actually very difficult and I like...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
It's fun to be challenged in that way.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah. So I guess in case anybody is wondering, you know, you think about college gymnastics as most people think of NCAA gymnastics, like the UCLA gymnasts or the, I don't know, who else, what the normal person that doesn't think much about gymnastics thinks about, but maybe probably UCLA gymnastics is what they think about when they see it. So that's NCAA. And then
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Michigan Yeah
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Nadi is not doing NCAA division one, two or three. She's doing club college club gymnastics, which they still compete against.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I think it's like NAIGC or something like that.
Alyssa Herrera-Set Right, NAIGC. So it's and it's a club team. And so I don't know how many people are familiar that with club sports in college, but I remember from college there being intramurals, which is like basically, you're competing against other people at your school. But club, club sports is somewhere in between in that you're competing against other schools.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
You're right.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
representing your school, but it's not NCAA Division I, II, or III.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Right. And like another thing is like it's not like necessarily funded that much by the school. You get like kind of a little bit. I'm actually not really sure how it works, but we had to do like a lot of fundraising for things like nationals was like we don't get that money from the school like an actual like recognized team would do you want to?
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Right. Your school's not paying for your uniform or providing you gym... Well, I guess maybe they do provide you gym space.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I actually don't know what our history is, but...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right, right.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Well, it's the coaches gym. So I don't know how that works, but we get to use like a northeastern van to go to the gym. So I don't know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, so okay, but this is like a long intro to the main reason why we got on this phone call, which was the topic that I wanted to bring up, which is leaking in sports. And this is like, you know, you don't want to like, I don't know, expose yourself. But I just want to say out there that like, before this podcast became Nadia and I, it was my really good friend, who's a physical
Nadia Herrera-Set
Hehehehe...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Tanya is a pelvic floor specialist. So she's a kind of physical therapist that works with people that have problems that they want to address in their pelvic area. It can be a lot of different things that we've talked about in the past, but one of which is leaking. And sometimes people leak because they have what's called like an urgency incontinence. And they like, you guys might be familiar with this, but someone who needs to run to the bathroom because they like all of a sudden have to pee really badly.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Um, and then they might leak a little bit on the way to the bathroom or like as they're unlocking the door or unzipping their pants. So that's like an urgency incontinence. There's also a stress incontinence, stress urinary incontinence, which, um, is basically when the pressure of like, um, the pressure around your bladder, uh, takes, is too much for the muscles to control the urine from leaking out. And so you
Nadia Herrera-Set
Thank you.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
leak when you, for example, run and jump. I bet a bunch of women out there can relate to this, but in general terms, you've heard people say, oh my God, I laughed so hard, I was going to almost peed my pants. Or like, oh my gosh, I peed a little bit when I sneezed. Or I can't jump on the trampoline because I feel like I'm going to leak my pants when I jump on the trampoline. These are common things that are like...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Thank you.
Uh-huh.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I want to say previously embarrassing to talk about, but I guess it probably still is embarrassing to talk about. And so I wanted to talk about what the culture is around leaking in gymnastics. And maybe you have not much to say, but how much do, in your experience with your old teammates and then your current teammates, how much are people talking about leaking?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Amen.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Um, I think as you got older, it was, I feel like when I was younger and it happened, like, it's-
was it's like recognized as like that's only a you thing like nobody this is not happening to anyone but as you got older and I feel like as I grew up with my teammates from home like we talked about it more and like I don't know it became a really normalized thing not necessarily to talk about but just like a known thing and almost to the point where like Like my coach would just laugh at like us if we ran to the bathroom
after being on floor. Like it was just like, which I feel like made it more, I made it normalized and it made it like less of like a weird thing that's happening. But definitely, I think even in, I mean, like now too, I think it just has to do with age and just like knowing what's happening with your body and be more comfortable with your body.
The conversation's there, but nobody really does anything about it. Like that's like, we can talk about it, but we don't know why it's happening or how to fix it. We're just gonna like let it happen and like laugh about it. Like, oh, I'm not gonna do this because I know I like, I feel like I know I'm gonna like pee my pants. Like, hey, not like that, but like, oh, I know after I do this, like I'm gonna have to go to the bathroom. Or I should probably go to the bathroom before four because like I don't want.
I don't want to like, you know, I've answered my full routine. Like stuff like that. Like we can talk, I could talk about that with my teammates and my teammates could talk about that with me, but we're not like necessarily gonna find anything, any solutions for it. We just like let it happen.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
It is so interesting because I think like, I'm like, I'm straddling here between being like mom talking to daughter and then like someone that like, you know, healthcare practitioner that kind of deals with this sometimes with other athletes. But I guess I'm going into the healthcare practitioner mode. It is pretty common. There are studies that show that up to
Nadia Herrera-Set
Uh huh.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
There have been whole teams, whole elite teams that have been polled to see how many of them have incontinence, and the answer was 100%. But the ranges of the different studies of how much people are having urinary incontinence during gymnastics is somewhere between 30% and 80%. So that's a wide range, but you can guess somewhere in between there. And this is important because
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
First of all, you can imagine if someone's leaking all the time and it's embarrassing or whatever, they might not do gymnastics anymore if they feel like they're leaking too much, or they might feel like they'll hold back on skills. So it's important that way. It's also important because your pelvic floor muscles, the ones that help you prevent leaking, are part of your core. So it's important to work on those muscles for performance also, like ability to have a strong core. And that doesn't mean just like contracting and strengthening by contracting, but also relaxing. And then it's also important because there are things, like it should be talked about because there are things that can be done about it. If you're still leaking, like the stories that I've heard from gymnasts when they do leak all the time, but they wanna do gymnastics still is they'll do things that like use, like period underwear when they're doing gymnastics so that it doesn't like leak through to their leotard. They'll use pads. They will, they'll actually, this is kind of interesting. They'll use a tampon. So that doesn't really make sense to you, right? It's like, shrunch your eyebrows. Like how does a tampon help with keying? Isn't that a different hole?
Nadia Herrera-Set Like, how does that make it like, feel like you're like, is it like a mental thing? Like you feel more like control of your muscles. Cause I don't know. Or like a physical thing, but like.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
It's not a mental thing. It's a physical thing. It's like pushing against the muscles. It's helping support the area by kind of helping create full up space so that the muscles don't have to work so hard because they're getting like kind of supported.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, that's interesting. Yeah. Oh, that's really interesting. I think... I...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
personally would use panty liners. I don't like wearing pads when I'm doing gymnastics. I don't like wearing pads in general because they're just really uncomfortable. But especially in gymnastics, it's like the worst. Imagine like doing gymnastics in a diaper anyways. But I also think that that, because of like, like you know what I'm saying, but also because of periods, like I feel like it kind of like.
goes hand in hand a little bit is when like girls start wearing shorts, spandex to practice and all that kind of thing. So which?
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Right. So it'll show less. Like if you're wearing black shorts, for example, then you won't be able to see the leaking if it happens for both period and...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Right. And you feel less exposed in general, but I don't know.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Right. I guess we can talk about hair removal in a future episode. Anyway, I do want to bring in someone who is actually not your mom, but someone who is a pelvic floor specialist that works with a lot of athletes. So we should do that in the future. Has anybody ever like fully leaked you or someone you know, like so that they have to wear a new leotard? Like you're in competition and you have like this wet spot in your leotard.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Ah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
It's actually like... Well for me I wear underwear. That's another thing. Like-
Alyssa Herrera-Set
But still, I mean, like, what if they leak so much that it's, like, dripping?
Nadia Herrera-Set
It's never, well, okay. In personal experience during a competition it hasn't happened like that. Like you will leak during a competition, but you go, like I personally would go to the bathroom before things, you know, before I go to floor, just like, like it's a just in case type thing. But like during practice, like.
Alyssa Herrera-Set (
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
if you really have to go pee and then something like it, if you're doing four and you also really have to go to the bathroom, sometimes it's bad and you just have to run to the bathroom. But I've never had to like change my leotard. It's just kind of something that you're going to have to deal with. And also it's not necessarily easy to be seen. It depends on the leotard you're wearing. I feel like
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Right. I mean, I feel bad for the people who have, like, I don't know, light-colored leotards, you know, or, yeah.
Nadia Herrera-Set
It's not like light colored. It's like if it's one color, if there's a pattern on it, it's less noticeable And if like you have like which is like with younger girls, they're not gonna they're not usually wearing the ones that I mean When I was younger, they're not usually wearing the ones with patterns. It's like the ones with They're just plain color, which I guess maybe not that's not everyone But for me personally, I wore the one color ones when I was younger, which makes it like way more noticeable
Alyssa Herrera-Set
hehe
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm. Couldn't you have a dark spot in the middle?
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, and like, I don't know. I guess it's an embarrassing thing throughout.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Um, okay. So... Oh, as you were talking, I was like, I had a question. Have you ever been in a competition, like competing on floor or on beam, because those routines are longer? Were you thought in the middle of your routine, as you're performing, oh my gosh, I have to go to the bathroom? Has it ever like...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Nadia Herrera-Set
No, I mean, if I'm going to be honest, like I kind of black out during those routines because I'm so nervous. But I think that things like sneezing, having to cough, like having a runny nose, like all those things, like honestly, I don't know what happens, but just stops like I can't like I don't think about anything unless something hurts, then I can think about that. But like I never had to like
Like you're not gonna stop your team to sneeze. That's like a fear, but like you've never, I've never had to do that because you're not thinking about that. And I don't know. I've never like, I mean.
Not that I really had to go pee, but like, oh, like I just like, I don't know. It, it, it like, you're not thinking about those things. I mean, I'm not, I'm so focused on like what I'm doing there, which I guess you have to be that like, I'm not thinking like, oh my goodness, I really, really have to go pee right now. I might have to run to the bathroom after. So you realize after I salute, but like, not like during, which I guess.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Mm-hmm.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
That's so interesting. Actually don't know, I should know probably, but I don't know the physiology behind. Why does nobody sneeze in the middle of their performance? Like...
Nadia Herrera-Set
Thank you.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I honestly am just like so focused on what I'm doing and like, I don't know.
It's very interesting. Um, but yeah. Never had to go pee during a routine.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, that's interesting.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
You might not be, I mean, this is just your experience. I'm thinking that if you asked other people, maybe who aren't as nervous as you or as focused as you or have more of an issue with incontinence, it might run through their mind right before they tumble or something like that. Yeah. Well.
Nadia Herrera-Set Mm-hmm. They might.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. Not me. Too nervous.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I just want to say while we're publicly speaking, I asked you when you got on the team to send me your competition schedule so I could watch.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I don't have a weight I kind of do.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
I mean, gosh, I have frat flu from you. Anyway, I asked you for your competition schedule so I could watch. And you're like, you're not coming to watch. But while we're here, when people are listening, can I come watch?
Nadia Herrera-Set
No.
Nadia Herrera-Set
I mean you can't. No? Well, yes you can watch, but it's gonna be here. I mean you might be here. You might be here. For one of them. I have no clue. I haven't.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Okay, maybe I'll come to your...
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Well, maybe I can go to your nationals.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Albuquerque.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Yeah, I've never been to New Mexico. I wanna go to New Mexico.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Me too.
Alyssa Herrera-Set
Um, all right. Well, nice talking to you, Nadia. Thanks for sharing your story. I know that you were like bracing yourself for what kind of things you're going to expose about yourself, but was that okay? All right. All right. Have a good weekend. Bye-bye.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah. Hehehehe.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Yeah, it was fine. It's okay. I'm open.
Nadia Herrera-Set
Bye.
How to nourish yourself in college with Wendy Sterling, RD
Alyssa Herrera-Set: Good morning! Hi Nadia, hi Wendy!
Wendy Sterling, RD: Hello!
Alyssa Herrera-Set: We are so excited to have you here today, Wendy. Wendy and I have worked together in the San Francisco Bay area on efforts to keep gymnasts healthy and so I'm really excited to have her on the podcast today. I'm going to introduce her and then Nadia has a few questions addressing some of the stuff we talked about in an earlier podcast about eating healthy in college and diet culture in college and also Eating Disorders. Let me start by introducing Wendy: Wendy Sterling is a certified eating disorder registered dietitian and a board certified specialist in sports dietetics. She specializes in Sports Nutrition, eating disorders, and utilizes a non-diet health at every size approach in her practice. Wendy maintains a private practice in the Bay Area California and sees clients virtually throughout the country. Wendy is an author on multiple books that focus on eating disorders and Body Image. Her latest book publishes next month and is called How to Nourish Yourself Through an Eating Disorder. in addition to working with local high schools and colleges, she has consulted with professional sports teams including the Oakland A's, the Golden State Warriors, the New York Jets and the New York Islanders .Wendy received her degree in dietetics and nutritional Sciences from Cornell University. She earned a master's degree in nutrition education at teach college at Columbia University, where she also completed her dietetic internship. Wendy is a former competitive dancer and All American cheerleader. Welcome Wendy!
Wendy STerling: Thank you. Thanks to you both for having me this morning!
Nadia Herrera-Set: Of course! My first question: a lot of uh our listeners are college students who are trying to decide what career they want to pursue. I wanted to ask you if you could tell us a little bit about how you decided to become a registered dietician ,and what the difference is between a registered dietitian and a nutritionist?
Wendy Sterling: Yeah, good question. so I picked nutrition um as my major literally out of uh a catalog. My sister was a Psychology major and I was very interested in that too. But as younger sisters will do, I wasn't going to do what she did. She was at Cornell at the time, and I fell in love with the college. And so I was looking through that big red book that came in the mail and I stumbled upon nutrition and I was like “wow you know this is awesome!” I was really attached to the Sciences I was really kind of nerdy that way. I loved chemistry and biology and I I really didn't want to give that up you know for example if I went into psychology. I loved the idea of working with people. I was a dancer, I was doing that ever since I could walk and so the idea of being able to fuel people, educate them, while also keeping the Sciences? Tt just seemed like a perfect fit. As for your second question about the difference between a dietitian and a nutritionist, really anyone can call themselves a nutritionist. There's not really any regulation. When you use the word dietitian, you're referring to a registered dietician which has certification and certain schooling and requirements, plus a uh formalized dietetic internship program that you apply for and get training in various categories like clinical nutrition and some food service and Community rotations. There's like a structure in a program. Finally, you'll take a test to become a registered dietitian. When you see a registered dietician we know that it is certified, whereas when we see nutritionist, we don't know what that means. Like anyone at the gym could be a nutritionist, or you know the person at the grocery store could be like “oh yeah I'm a nutritionist.” And so sometimes people use the word nutritionist because it more casual, but I think when you go through the schooling, you know, we tend to prefer registered dietician.
Nadia: Yeah, it's definitely interesting if people can just offer their advice and because they have the title of “nutritionist,” people will just end up believing them when they might not have the education for that.
Alyssa: I've actually like, as a physical therapist, when I have um athletes come in at the On the Move PT clinic, I encourage them to get some specialty advice regarding nutrition. Oftentimes, they reach out to a nutritionist and I get a little bit concerned because I don't know what their educational background is. So I really wanted you to be able to answer that question for our audience because I don't think the average person realizes that there's a difference between registered dietitian and nutritionist.
Wendy Sterling: And I'm sure there are really educated nutritionists out there who have done a ton of work and can give you some great information. But there are also some that just carry the title “nutritionist” and put it after their name because you know they've done some weekend work or they care about it a lot or whatever, but don't have a lot of scientific background necessarily behind their advice. I think it's really important for young folks out there, for everybody out there, to understand the difference. And I guess while we're on the topic, I might as well add that there are lots of influencers on social media who have hundreds of thousands of followers and often don't have any credentials as well, right. And they will interact very intimately with their followers and provide lots of really beautiful videos, and are very seductive in their messaging. But often the messaging that they're giving is not accurate for, let's say, a teenager. Or not accurate for the person who's listening. And so we always will also say “hey, who are you following?” and like “are they reputable?” and “do they have the appropriate credentials?” just to kind of make sure. Because a lot of times, people are taking the material that they're getting from social media as face value. And often, they don't have access to a registered dietitian and that is the only information they're getting.
Nadia: Yeah that's, I mean, that's very important to hear. Personally on Tik Tok I get those videos all the time: people offering like dieting or food advice. And obviously there's people that are taking their advice but you never know what intentions they have and if it even like can be applicable to the person watching.
Alyssa: On a previous episode we talked about parents who incentivize their kids to not gain the Freshman 15. What are your thoughts on that?
Wendy Sterling: Oh you can't imagine how much I hate that. I'm really sorry for anyone who has had that happen to them. I mean, I really felt, when I like saw that you might be asking that, I — my heart just felt really broken at the thought of that. I think what that says to the kid is “gosh, you know, your weight is so important to me that I am going to pay you to stay at this weight.” And kids don't forget that. That stays with them forever. And not only does it stay with them forever, but the weight at which they were paid to stay at also stays with them forever. So that should they exceed that weight, which by the way most likely they will because the weight at which they are as a freshman in college is not meant to be their forever weight (there's no forever weight bodies are changing, especially as a freshman you know our our bodies and hormones and our you everything is just evolving right), but when they when they exceed that weight they remember “gosh I was this number when I was younger and it causes a lot of shame and it causes a lot of body image dissatisfaction. It’s also sending the message that should my body change, my family won't approve of me. And so it's a really unfortunate paradigm that a family would set up for their kid upon going to school. There seems to be so many more important things to be thinking about with your kid as they are leaving for college… Alcohol, for example, might be another one. Or safety, you know?
Nadia: Yeah, yeah I definitely, I mean my freshman year of college which was just last year it's very hard to be living away from your parents and having to choose your own food to begin with. So I can't imagine like having to think about “oh if I'm eating this I might you know… thinking about my weight and all this because I'm just trying to like not be hungry all day”
Alyssa: Totally. But yeah, on that note it's tough for a parent to figure out when to keep their mouth shut when they think that their offspring, their adult child, is making unhealthy decisions whether that's eating unhealthily or not sleeping well or partying too much, making some questionable friends all those things. Like as a as a parent of a kid who's just like gone to college, you don't know when to speak up and when not to, right? So um what are your thoughts about the communication between a parent and a child regarding healthy eating once they're in college? Like how much should we be saying? I mean actually I'll give you a personal… can I share Nadia? can I share our experience? Okay so, one time I was telling Nadia I was like oh so you know we had this conversation and it was probably right before lunch and I was like “so um you're living in the dorms, what did you have for breakfast this morning?” and she's like “um I had apples.” and I was like “oh, where did you get that from? Did you get that from the the dining Commons or from Trader Joe's?” and she… I don't remember what she said. And then I was like “okay… and where are you off to now?” she's like “I'm off to lunch.” she's like “I'm gonna go get Popeye's fried chicken sandwich.” and I was like hmmm. she's like “I'm going to do a meal exchange at popeye's for a fried chicken sandwich.” I'm like “Is that really the healthiest choice?” and she's like “I don't need to tell you everything I'm eating.” so I was like oop. I went a little bit too far. so I guess yeah, so that's my question… Like how would you navigate that?
Wendy Sterling: Yeah, parents almost always say too much. And you know the the focus ideally you know, it's tricky. I think when kids are probably out of the house because you're not seeing everything. Like in in the case with Nadia, I'm sure she's not going to popeye's all all the time every day is probably my my guess. And you know so I think it's a little trickier for parents commenting. Your adult kid is reporting one thing and then you're reacting, but you don't see what's happening every day. It's hard not to react because sometimes you get tidbits of information and then it feels a little bit provocative, and you want to say something. But what you don't know is the rest of the seven days: the seven breakfasts, whatever else she had for lunch. So sometimes you can just get curious rather than being reactive like “oh like you know Popeyes? Like where else do you go with your friends?” or “Do you go to the dining hall?” or like “what do you are you eating in the dining hall?” You know? You can ask some more questions. That might be one thing, but I think as it pertains to the kids who are in the house more, parents almost always say too much. And what we really want to do is to try to create this peaceful relationship with food and body where where all foods and all bodies really are welcome. But instead there does tend to be a lot of scrutiny where comments about what kids are eating and how much they're eating. And the reality is like no one else could know how much you need or how much another body needs. Appetites vary day-to- day and it even varies meal to meal. So even in that example you know with Nadia, like she didn't have much breakfast and most likely she needed a much bigger lunch because she was probably really hungry. So if someone observed her at lunch and made a comment about what she was eating volume wise, they would have not known that she was really hungry because she didn't have morning snack and she didn't have breakfast. We often see parents coming in in the middle and kind of then saying things like “wow do you need all that?” or like “you have such a big appetite” and this really discourages kids from satisfying their full hunger and can alter the course of the rest of their day because maybe then they don't finish what they actually needed or they restrict or causes a lot of guilt and shame. And then you know this idea of like oh these are good foods and then these bad foods, it can then create guilt or shame because then it feels like I'm eating the wrong thing or I ate a bad thing. But really if like all food was just okay and neutral, then it would really lead to a lot more peace. But we see it trickling into body image because if somebody ate the wrong thing or bad thing that's deemed that way in a parent eyes, then all of a sudden you start to feel really dissatisfied and uncomfortable in your body.
Alyssa: I mean I think that's what we tend to do. It's very complicated. I'll keep my mouth shut more (laughs).
Nadia: I mean I personally don't remember that conversation but it really stuck with her.
Alyssa: It did. I was like oh this is was like a red flag this is going in the wrong direction, I need to change course I need to change the way that I'm communicating with my daughter. I'm glad it didn't stick in your mind.
Nadia: I must have been having a bad day. My next question: like myself, kids who do high school School sports often see a huge decline in the amount of exercise they get in at the start of college and even throughout college. Do you have any nutritional tips for transitioning away from a 10 to 20 hour like exercise routine per week to just working out a few hours a week on your own?
Wendy Sterling: Yeah, the biggest thing is that nutritional needs most likely in that scenario will decrease and the frequency with which somebody is taking their pre and their post-workout fueling snacks and the composition of one's plates are going to shift in terms of how we're recommending the macronutrients on the plate, in terms of the volume of carbohydrates are going to shift to a different kind of plate. When the intensity, the frequency, the duration of one's training changes that way. What we want to kind of begin to coach our athletes on is their hunger and their fullness as well. I think a lot of times when somebody's training and training intensely they really can't necessarily, they don't necessarily feel their hunger. Sometimes the hunger levels are suppressed with really intense training. I think when training decreases to kind of a low to moderate level it's maybe easier to feel hunger and so we begin to say like hey are you hungry? Are you full? Where is your hunger level, where is your fullness level? So we'll begin to coach them on that. Then something else that I see happening when people are transitioning out of their sport is actually that people start picking up other sports and I think sometimes they don't realize that even though it's not their main sport, there's a significant impact potentially in their new set of training. In the types of training that they're doing. So for example, a gymnast might decide that he or she or they like running and all of a sudden, they never ran before it wasn't part of their training, but now there's a significant impact that their running has on their energy needs. And even though it's not 10 to 20 hours it's quite possible that there's a significant energy cost associated with that training. And sometimes our athletes get into a state of energy deficiency even post-retirement. Like in retirement, and that always surprises them. And we see that a lot actually, it's actually called relative energy deficiency in sport. The acronym is called REDS and it can happen in season like in the height of their sport and it can also happen in retirement as people all of a sudden become cyclists out of the blue, or they start training for a marathon, or they start training for something else um they just don't they don't account for things that actually aren't making them sweat the same way they used to sweat. For example walking the dog for three to four miles they're like “ah it's not exercise it's not movement doesn't really count” but actually if you're walking the dog three to four miles and then you're running later that day and then you're also walking to the supermarket, all of these things actually need to be accounted for um with your food.
Nadia: Great advice, thank you. So we talked a little bit and during your intro about how you are specialized in Eating Disorders. My question is what can a college student do if they suspect that their friend has an eating disorder?
Sterling: I think it's good to confront the friend and to talk about it with the friend and see if the friend needs some support. We've had some circumstances actually where friends have reached out to the parents or the support system of that suspected person with an eating disorder. Eating Disorders can be really sneaky. A lot of people are in denial about that so it can often take a lot of repeated advances to kind of get somebody that help that they need. I think that friends always they can always make a change because maybe the person, whether or not they realize it, hearing it from someone they respect and also listen to all the time changes things.
Alyssa: Do you have any advice on words you might use with your friend? Like would you be casual about it, would you be direct?
Sterling: You know yeah I think honest and I think also pointing out like “you seem really tired, you seem irritable, you seem different” you know pointing out some of the things that have caught your attention… “I'm concerned about you, I've noticed that you no longer come out with us, I noticed that you no longer are at lunch with us anymore” you know. “I notice that you're always exercising, have you seen a doctor?” We don't want to be accusing of them, you just sort of want to state your observations kind of neutrally. You don't want to attack and you certainly don't necessarily want to um comment on weight and body necessarily. But I think loving kind gentle uh is is certainly the approach that I would recommend. And not necessarily using the words disordered eating or like that. I wouldn't diagnose anyone, I would just state your observations of the things that have caught your eye you know? The things that you're worried about.
Alyssa: Okay great advice. So I think you have one more question right, Nadia?
Nadia: Yeah one more question it's do you have any tips on getting the right nutrients and healthy food when you're eating on a budget whether it's from the cafeteria or buying food on your own?
Sterling: Yeah, so our approach that we use in eating disorder recovery but I also use it with my athletes is called the plate by plate approach and that is where we are recommending that you're filling the plate with all five food groups. That's protein, starch, a dairy or a dairy alternative, vegetables or fruit, and fats. And that way you're really getting all of your nutrients in. So if you think about going into the dining hall and looking for source of protein whether that's chicken or meat or if you're a vegetarian beans or tofu, and then thinking in terms of what starch: what am I going to fill my plate with whether that's rice or pasta or some kind of grain, breads, cereals, waffles you know whatever that is. And then looking for some kind of calcium source: cheese, dairy, milk, soy milk. And then some kind of vegetable or fruit and then think about what kind of fat source. And then in terms of budget if you are not in a dining hall and you're on your own you know milk is a very inexpensive source of calcium. Cheap proteins are eggs and beans and you know chicken doesn't have to be that expensive. Refried beans which by the way is a misnomer, there's not actually much fat, anyway. But things like that are are pretty cheap. Tuna is a pretty inexpensive source of protein, rice is inexpensive, and then frozen fruits and vegetables which don't get much attention are actually a wonderful nutrient rich way um for people on a budget to get in lots of good anti-inflammatory um sources of fiber. And the best thing about that is that there really is no waste. I think a lot of times people bring in fresh fruits and vegetables and then there's so much waste because they don't get to it or some gets moldy. But what's really nice about the frozen is that it it's it just really costeffective and there's there's no waste. You can add that to a smoothie, you can thaw it and use it you know right into a bowl um like in the morning. I think that also can help.
Nadia: Yeah I can go to the dining hall but I have a kitchen this year so that's been something that I've been having to figure out on my own. It's definitely hard to buy like the fresh fruits and vegetables because it's not like I'm going to eat every all of it like every single day, and then I'm having to throw it out because before I can even get to it, it's like it's moldy. So the frozen section of Trader Joe's is my friend I think.
Sterling: I think for the dorm too: like things like apples and pears and bananas they tend to last longer and you know it's like the berries that tend to go bad first that make it harder. Those might be good to buy frozen and I know it's hard in a dorm to Store Frozen um but if there is freezer access that that would be that would be good. And then just thinking of meals that you can do like little burritos or quesadillas or things that are just not super expensive that you can get multiple uses out of.
Alyssa: Yeah, definitely thank you. We had a funny we had a funny conversation a couple weeks ago. Nadia showed up on FaceTime and she had this block of frozen chicken like four chicken breasts you know with a plastic on top of it and styrofoam on the bottom or whatever's on the bottom and she's like “I'm eating this tonight.” It's like rock solid. “What do I do about… what do?” I'm like oh my goodness well “Is it sliceable? can you chop into it?” she's like you know hacking at it I was like okay that does not look safe, you're just going have to defrost the whole thing and cook the whole thing and maybe you can freeze some of the stuff that you already made. Maybe you should individually put chicken in the freezer
Sterling: Absolutely, I found my frozen chicken alternative. They're individually Frozen so I don't have to you know do the whole thing and then have to eat all the chicken you made. coms individually Frozen yeah it's like in a bag I mean it's like a weird a weird thing, but if I can just take one out and that's my lunch then you know that's really easy. Yeah, and I think you'll find some tricks along those lines like you can take it out of the freezer and put it in the refrigerator the night before and then it thaws for you which is really nice.
Nadia: Yeah it's definitely a learning process.
Alyssa: It is a learning process and you won't make that mistake again with that (laughs) Everybody goes through that. Wendy I have a question and I don't know if this is going to open up a whole can of worms, I hope it's not too challenging of a question to answer on this podcast. You seem to have a filter towards helping people who are under fueling with relative energy deficiency and people who need to eat a lot for their sport. What about people whose problem is overeating? Is that also called disordered eating and how can you help with that?
Sterling: Yeah we have lots of patients in our practice um who struggle with either bypassing their body's natural stopping place or who truly struggle with something called binge eating disorder. In my next book we are talking about how our plate by plate approach can be used to actually help patients through that. One of the biggest causes of something like overeating or binge eating disorder is actually restriction, so what we find is that people are more likely to buypass their body stopping place if for example they are using a diet mindset. Or they are may be living in a larger body and they are trying to cut back on their food because they are trying to diet, or they're trying to lose weight. And so what tends to happen is they go through their day and they're like oh I'm just going to eat a little bit at breakfast I'm going to eat a little bit at lunch and then they get to dinner and they can't find their natural stopping place and they tend to bypass it. Or alternatively as some of our patients do, and by the way binge eating disorder is the most common eating disorder out there so more people people are struggling with that than any other eating disorder, they binge which is eating a larger amount of food that most would consider to be typical in a certain period of time. The reason that happens is because they haven't had enough to eat throughout the day. They are in deficit from not having had enough um throughout the the day: perhaps missing an afternoon snack that they needed. It's common in athletes, it's common in males, and it's certainly common really common when people restrict. Now there are many causes besides just the physiological cause why people um binge. It can also be emotional, it can be to due to boredom, it can be due to stress. And so we know that there are a combination of factors that lead to why people might binge and so often when we have people that are struggling with for example a binge eating disorder or something like that, we are doing a combination work with a dietitian to look at their food to make sure that they are eating regular and consistent meals with all five food groups: breakfast lunch snack dinner snack. Not skipping meals no dieting, like really eating regularly. They're working often in combination with a therapist to manage stress, to look at alternative coping mechanisms for times when they're feeling bored, and learning to not use food to cope. And so it becomes pretty complicated and we tend to work as a team which is really interesting.
Alyssa: Thank you so much Wendy. We know you have a book coming out next month, can you tell us just before we go a little bit about what services you provide to people and where people can find you ?
Wendy Sterling: Yeah yeah thank you for asking. So I am a sports dietician and an eating disorder specialist. I help athletes with their performance, but I also help adults and teens and kids with both Sports Nutrition or with anyone struggling with eating. Whether that's disordered eating or actual Eating Disorders. My book which is coming out next month is actually for adults and it's to help them through their relationship with food and their eating disorder. I can be found on Instagram, we have a handle called plate-by-plate approach which is for those with eating disorders looking for visuals on what the plate should be with eating disorder messaging. My handle is @wendy_sterling and then my website is sterlingnutrition.com
Alyssa: Perfect thank you so much for being here with us today, Wendy. That was really like helpful like usable information for the college students and for the parents.
Wendy Sterling: I'm so glad thank you so much for having me it's so lovely to connect with you both again.